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| Webber, Phil Hale, and Heiser looked up to Scaer as a genius professor of dogmatics. Imagine. |
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| McCain and Cascione repeated this delirious nonsense quoted by Robert Preus. Everyone is born forgiven, babies forgiven before infant baptism? |
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| This power team dazzled the scattered crowd at Emmaus. |
Like · 1m David Jay Webber
ELDoNA confesses that Jesus died and rose again for the sins of the whole world, that he propitiated God for the sins of the whole world, that he atoned for the sins of the whole world, and that he acquired righteousness and forgiveness for the whole world. What they deny is that God the Father, as a consequence of his Son's death and resurrection for the whole world, absolved and justified his Son on the whole world's behalf [GJ - Halle Pietism Error], and in and through that vicarious absolution and justification of Christ, absolved and justified the whole world for which he had died. [GJ - Halle Pietism Error]
A part of what triggered the ELDoNA pastors against objective justification / objective forgiveness, is the sloppy way in which that doctrine was sometimes explained in the 20th century. One particularly clumsy statement was that in objective justification God looked into hell and gave everyone there the status of a saint. That is nonsensical and is not a correct reflection of what objective justification really means. In objective justification, God did not look into hell; God looked upon his Son, who had carried the sins of the world to the cross and whose atonement for those sins was successful, so that God as a consequence justified Jesus [GJ - Halle Pietism Error] - and in, with, and under that justification of Jesus, God thereby justified the world for which Jesus had died. [GJ - Halle Pietism Error. On the Intrepid Lutherans, Webber quoted Pietist Rambach against Chemnitz.]
What this objective justification of the world's Redeemer did was basically establish the objective truth and the objective content of the means of grace, that is now announced and distributed to penitent sinners. What the objective justification of the world's Redeemer means is that there is a finished and complete gospel of justification and forgiveness in Christ, to be proclaimed and applied to individual human beings, not merely a potential justification or a potential forgiveness that much be completed by the act of faith. [GJ - Straw Man Fallacy, contradicted in the next sentence.] Faith receives God's justification in Christ. Faith does not complete or help to bring about justification, and faith does not prompt God to create a separate and individual justification for each individual who believes in the message of his potential justification, in that moment of believing.
Back in the 1970s and early 1980s there was a controversy over this in the LCMS, focusing on the Ft. Wayne seminary, involving Robert Preus and Kurt Marquart on the pro-objective justification side, and Walter Maier on the anti-objective justification [<-GJ - Justification by Faith, aka The Chief Article!] side. This controversy was settled through a carefully-written statement that explains what objective justification really is (clarifying some misunderstandings), which Walter Maier could and did sign. [GJ - According to D. Scaer, R. Preus consulted with Calvinists to support Justification Before Faith.] So, it was settled in the Fort Wayne seminary at that time. And it can and should be settled by everyone else today, on the same basis. It is one of the most useless and confusing controversies going on today, [GJ - But you and others are showing how thoroughly Calvinistic WELS-ELS-LCMS are! Thank you.] and also one of easiest to settle, because all the heavy lifting on settling it has already been done. Here is the statement that Walter Maier submitted to the Fort Wayne Board of Control on January 30, 1981, which expressed his agreement with the doctrine of justification as correctly explained in a balanced and careful manner:
<<When the Lord Jesus was “justified” (I Timothy 3:16) in His resurrection and exaltation, God acquitted Him not of sins of His own, but of all the sins of mankind, which as the Lamb of God He had been bearing (John 1:29), and by the imputation of which He had been “made...to be sin for us” (II Corinthians 5:21), indeed, “made a curse for us” (Galatians 3:13). In this sense, the justification of Jesus was the justification of those whose sins He bore. The treasure of justification or forgiveness gained by Christ for all mankind is truly offered, given, and distributed in and through the Gospel and sacraments of Christ. Faith alone can receive this treasure offered in the Gospel, and this faith itself is entirely a gracious gift and creation of God through the means of grace. Faith adds nothing to God’s forgiveness in Christ offered in the Gospel, but only receives it. Thus, “He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and He that believeth not the Son, shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on Him” (John 3:30).>>
[GJ - David Scaer was still peeved and not happy with the Maier family, as he admitted in his wacky book. The Preus Crime Family used this topic as a political club to bruise Maier as a presidential candidate and to elevate Robert Preus. However, Robert's last book clearly repudiates Justification Before and Without Faith, so Rolf does not mention it anymore.]
David Jay Webber For reference, and so as to avoid unnecessary repetition, about 15 weeks ago there was a HUGE discussion of objective justification in this thread: https://www.facebook.com/groups/WELSDiscussions/permalink/2929918767232564/
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