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| Defeat the Dark Side (UOJ) with the Means of Grace. |
bruce-church (https://bruce-church.myopenid.com/) has left a new comment on your post "LCMS Pastor Vernon Harley - Synergism -- Its Logic...":
Vernon Harley's combined papers (pdf):
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/34974726/lcms-pastor-vernon-harley-combined-papers_vs_UOJ.pdf
We could use WAM's as well. The WELS Holy of Holies is not downloading it - probably due to demand from the Steadfast Enthusiasts.
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Maier PDF - direct Dropbox link.
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Brett Meyer has left a new comment on your post "Vernon Harley's Essays - Also Linked on the Left":
You rang?
http://www.wlsessays.net/files/MaierJustification.pdf
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LPC has left a new comment on your post "Vernon Harley's Essays - Also Linked on the Left":
Bruce,
I have reviewed Maier's paper once more and there are no alternative verses that he claimed teach OJ.
In fact he explicitly stated, Scripture teaches only ONE justification, the justification by faith.
LPC
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bruce-church (https://bruce-church.myopenid.com/) has left a new comment on your post "Vernon Harley's Essays - Also Linked on the Left":
Thanks LPC. Can the Maier paper on UOJ be made to square at all with this published statement?:
The book "Doctrine is Life: The Essays of Robert D. Preus on Justification and the Lutheran Confessions," Ed. Klemet I. Preus (CPH, 2006) says in the "Objective Justification" chapter which was written by Robert D. Preus during or shortly after the Maier UOJ conflict:
"...Dr. Maier has remained unpersuaded that his interpretation of the pertinent passages is faulty. At the same time he has consistently assured all that he has always taught the doctrine of objective justification as understood in the Missouri Synod. He has, however, referred to other Biblical evidence for the doctrine" (p. 151).
That would be "other" passages besides the "pertinent" ones given as: "Romans 4:25; Romans 5:16-19; II Corinthians 5:19" (p. 150).
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bruce-church (https://bruce-church.myopenid.com/) has left a new comment on your post "Vernon Harley's Essays - Also Linked on the Left":
If Maier (WAM2) reportedly was a UOJer his whole life, and reportedly taught UOJ at Ft. Wayne, yet his writings indicate the exact opposite, it adds credence to Dr. Jackson's contention that Robert Preus rejected UOJ before he died, despite those who are skeptical of that claim.
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GJ - The faculty voted that they were all orthodox when I was there. That made it true, of course. One of the Preus clan laughed about that. I went to a class where Kadai was teaching. He was one of their liberals. He wanted a summary of Barth, so I said, as a visitor, "He suggested speaking with a newspaper in one hand and the Bible in the other." Kadai liked that - it was the right answer. I added, "But others say Barth spoke with the newspaper in one hand, a Kalashnikov in the other, while standing on the Bible." Kadai was not happy with my reference to Barth the Marxist. But they were all orthodox.
And Preus wrote an entire book about justification without mentioning OJ or UOJ, because...?
The UOJ Enthusiasts used the same excuse with the Book of Concord, whose authors would have taught UOJ if they had realized how much we needed to comprehend the mystery. They just took it for granted, doncha know.
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LutherRocks has left a new comment on your post "Vernon Harley's Essays - Also Linked on the Left":
It is all about child like faith. The way the Gospel is laid out cover to cover in the Bible, is easily understood by children. And yet men feel the need to turn God's cheerful willingness to forgive into some kind of philosophical argument. I posted the example of the brazen serpent which succinctly shows faith=forgiveness/salvation; lack of faith=eternal damnation on BJS and the philosophers immediately went to work...oh, I almost forgot. LOL.
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LPC has left a new comment on your post "Vernon Harley's Essays - Also Linked on the Left":
Bruce,
Very good insight, UOJ once again demonstrates its fallacy.
LPC
9 comments:
You rang?
http://www.wlsessays.net/files/MaierJustification.pdf
Here's the WELS Essay Maier paper from Dropbox:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/34974726/MaierJustification.pdf
Dr. Jackson,
After you read Maier's paper, please let the readers know if Maier ever specified in his paper exactly what verses he thought taught UOJ.
He said the standard UOJ verses didn't teach it, but if I recall correctly, he never mentioned what verses he thought did teach it.
Bruce,
I have reviewed Maier's paper once more and there are no alternative verses that he claimed teach OJ.
In fact he explicitly stated, Scripture teaches only ONE justification, the justification by faith.
LPC
Thanks LPC. Can the Maier paper on UOJ be made to square at all with this published statement?:
The book "Doctrine is Life: The Essays of Robert D. Preus on Justification and the Lutheran Confessions," Ed. Klemet I. Preus (CPH, 2006) says in the "Objective Justification" chapter which was written by Robert D. Preus during or shortly after the Maier UOJ conflict:
"...Dr. Maier has remained unpersuaded that his interpretation of the pertinent passages is faulty. At the same time he has consistently assured all that he has always taught the doctrine of objective justification as understood in the Missouri Synod. He has, however, referred to other Biblical evidence for the doctrine" (p. 151).
That would be "other" passages besides the "pertinent" ones given as: "Romans 4:25; Romans 5:16-19; II Corinthians 5:19" (p. 150).
Bruce,
My answer is that the Maier paper challenges the claim made by that statement.
In that paper, Maier concentrated on rebutting all the choice and best UOJ Scripture used to prop UOJ, which you quoted.
The onus is on Preus to demonstrate what are those passages of Scripture that Maier vouched as teaching UOJ. As it stands this is arguing from silence and again making a claim without substantial backing.
The Maier paper is very clear, it is a critique of UOJ. One just needs to go to the conclusion to determine if Maier suggested alternative Scriptures for UOJ, he would have summarized it there, but nope.
LPC
If Maier (WAM2) reportedly was a UOJer his whole life, and reportedly taught UOJ at Ft. Wayne, yet his writings indicate the exact opposite, it adds credence to Dr. Jackson's contention that Robert Preus rejected UOJ before he died, despite those who are skeptical of that claim.
It is all about child like faith. The way the Gospel is laid out cover to cover in the Bible, is easily understood by children. And yet men feel the need to turn God's cheerful willingness to forgive into some kind of philosophical argument. I posted the example of the brazen serpent which succinctly shows faith=forgiveness/salvation; lack of faith=eternal damnation on BJS and the philosophers immediately went to work...oh, I almost forgot. LOL.
Bruce,
Very good insight, UOJ once again demonstrates its fallacy.
LPC
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