Thrivent Justifying the Wicked - Themselves

At least this isn't the Thrivent mascot.
 I hope not.

Thrivent: Repent or Take Off the Fleece

March 17th, 2014Post by Pastor Eric Andersen

Last week a financial representative from Thrivent stopped by my house. The purpose of his visit was 2-fold: to drop off some materials advertising an upcoming seminar he wanted me to promote in my congregations, and also to respond to some concerns he’d heard that I had with Thrivent via one of my members.

I appreciated his visit and also the fact that he did not try to justify Thrivent’s decision to remain “neutral” on the issues of abortion and homosexuality (you can find Thrivent’s neutrality policy here: https://service.thrivent.com/forms/thriventchoice/neutrality.html. In fact, he even expressed his own disappointment in Thrivent’s neutrality policy, himself being an LCMS Lutheran.

However, the rep encouraged me to continue to promote Thrivent in the congregations I serve despite all of this, thus, the posters and bulletin inserts he left with me. His reasoning was this: even though Thrivent isn’t perfect, at least they aren’t as bad as everyone else. He expressed his frustration that the LCMS publically expressed their concerns with Thrivent (http://blogs.lcms.org/2014/lcms-initial-reaction-to-thrivents-financial-neutrality-policy) while continuing to do business with MetLife, who administers the Concordia Retirement Savings plan (http://www.concordiaplans.org/detailpage.aspx?ID=437), despite their “long history of commitment to the LGBT community” (https://www.metlife.com/lgbt/index.html). The rep’s logic was this: even though Thrivent won’t take a position either way on issues of sexual orientation, at least they aren’t active in supporting the LGBT community.

Should the LCMS utilize the services of MetLife, despite their support of the LGBT community? I don’t know. The Bible is clear that much of what the LGBT community advocates is sexual sin, and this is something Christians and churches ought not promote. I’m inclined to think that the only way we can avoid working with those who promote sin is to retreat from the world—and Christians are certainly not called to that. At least MetLife doesn’t claim to be a Christian organization.

And that’s the heart of the problem with Thrivent. If they can’t take a biblical stand on clearly biblical issues like abortion and sexual orientation, they should quit pretending to be a Christian organization. The “About Us” page of Thrivent’s website says, “Thrivent Financial is a financial services organization that helps Christians be wise with money and live generously,” (https://www.thrivent.com/aboutus/index.html), and their current tagline is “connecting faith and finances for good.”

If their goal is to connect faith and finances, shouldn’t Thrivent support pro-life organizations? Do they consider it “unwise” to support life? Can one remain truly remain neutral when it comes to taking a stand on the fifth and sixth commandments? Jesus says, “Whoever is not with me is against me and whoever does not gather with me scatters,” (Luke 11:23). Love for the things of the world (1 John 2:15—16) and the desire for the approval of man (Galatians 1:10) seems to be driving this “neutrality” decision, not a commitment to faithful Christian stewardship.   

To be fair, there are many within Thrivent who are disappointed with Thrivent’s new “neutrality” policy. But that’s not enough. Christians (and Christian organizations) cannot be neutral when it comes to confessing the truth of God’s Word. You’re either with Jesus or you’re against Him. And, for my part, If I’m going to do business with a wolf, I’d rather it not come to me in sheep’s clothing. So Thrivent, here’s a simple plea: repent, re-commit yourself to Christian values, or please take off the fleece. 

Epilogue: As for the materials the rep left for me on the upcoming seminar, I’m thinking about adopting my own “neutrality policy” when it comes to promoting financial service organizations in my congregations.

***

GJ - 

No, LCMS and WELS should not be promoting a business in exchange for a few bucks or even for a few million bucks.

At this rate WELS will soon have its Marvin Schwan Convention, after selling naming rights to the frozen food company.

WELS/ELS/LCMS - outraged by justification by faith - but perfectly calm about working with ELCA through Thrivent.

Waking Up to Thrivent's Evil - With Mark Jeske on the Thrivent Board

http://thebarebulb.com/2014/01/08/an-odd-choice/

An Odd Choice

Posted by Todd Wilken on January 8, 2014

The guy in the Mercedes full of cash is Jordan Belfort, the real-life “Wolf of Wall Street.” Leonardo DiCaprio portrays Belfort in the new movie based on his memoir of penny stocks, prostitutes, cocaine and crime.

Belfort defrauded the clients of his Stratton Oakmont brokerage house out of more than $110 million in the late 1990s. He made (stole) a lot of money for (from) a lot of people. He still owes those people almost $100 million in restitution.

Belfort was also one of the speakers at the most recent Thrivent Financial for Lutherans‘ National Sales Meeting.

No joke.

Belfort seems an odd choice of speaker to address Thrivent’s sales force. Thivent’s website says, “Thrivent Financial does what’s best for our members, supporting the values of faith, family, stewardship and service.” So was Belfort there to teach Thrivent’s salespeople how not to do their jobs?

That must be it.

***

 GJ - It is well known that AAL/LB (Thrivent) converted whole life policies into Universal Life by giving half the cash value to the salesman as a commission. AAL/LB promised any interest the client or sucker wanted to predict. As everyone knows now, high investment rates are never sustained for long.

One LB salesman illustrated 12%, giving me a fortune at 65. His calculator printed it out. It had to be true. I protested that was impossible, because I knew a little about investments.

One AAL salesman told me that many of his friends retired with a fortune after doing this to their long-term clients. However Universal Life did not pan out and never paid those high rates. The policies tended to tank, requiring more money to keep up the same death benefit. (UL is defined as term insurance with a flexible side portion of cash.)

Those whole life policies had guaranteed values and prices, but the UL replacements promised nothing.

So I think this speaker was ideal for Thrivent - a grifter speaking to grifters.

Intrepid Lutherans - This Is "Intrepid" - Just So You Know

LCMS/WELS Pastor Mark and Avoid Jeske
sits on the Thrivent Board.

Thrivent Choice Controversy – An Overview

http://daringlutheran.net/thrivent-choice-controversy/

On or about December 17th, 2013, it was discovered that Planned Parenthood of Minnesota, North Dakota, and South Dakota had appeared in the Thrivent Choice database. Thrivent Choice is a member-directed grant program funded by Thrivent Financial, “a faith-based, not-for-profit membership organization nearly 2.5 million members strong.”

Much controversy erupted, with large protests online directed against Thrivent and asking them to immediately remove Planned Parenthood from the list of approved Thrivent Choice organizations, and to setup a moral criteria for organizations allowed in the Thrivent Choice program.

This page is intended to provide an overview of the events and related links pertaining to the controversy. Please provide any additional links that should be included.

December 17th, 2013

• Thrivent’s Dangerous Game is published, outlining initial conversations on Twitter with Thrivent surrounding the issue.

December 18th, 2013

• My article is republished by LifeNews.com and SteadfastLutherans.org.
• After more investigation, it’s discovered that Thrivent Choice dollars, if given to Planned Parenthood, would be undesignated and therefore directly fund abortions. (Thrivent Does Not Have the Komen “Out”)

December 19th, 2013

• The Lutheran Church – Missouri Synod issues a statement on the matter.
• The Lutheran Church – Missouri Synod Reporter published a more detailed news story.
• The Wisconsin Evangelical Lutheran Synod also issues a statement.

December 20th, 2013

• Thrivent issues a statement officially responding to the controversy. In their response, they remove Planned Parenthood from the list of eligible Thrivent Choice organizations.
• At the same time, Thrivent also temporarily removes all pro-life organizations from the program. (Thrivent’s Statement)
• My article “Thrivent’s Statement” is republished at LifeNews.com.
• The LCMS responds to Thrivent statement with a statement of their own.
• The LCMS Reporter publishes a follow-up news story.
• A list of the “temporarily suspended” organizations is published. (Download PDF)
• Christianity Today publishes a short story on the controversy.
• Christian Life Resources issues a statement on the controversy.

Ongoing

• Issues, Etc. has a half-hour open-lines discussion of the controversy. (12/20/13)
• Rev. Todd Wilken posts some thoughts about Thrivent’s resolution. (12/21/13)

Lutheran Satire Video

Divine Call - Thrivent Insurance Salesman

Kinda like a pastor selling insurance products as a divine call.

http://www.wels.net/about-wels/synod-reports/call-report-archive

Stern, Rev Jonathan D      Conference of Preside (sic) - Waukesha WI  12/15/2013
         Christian giving counselor, AZCA & SC districts

A requirement of Planned Giving Counselors is that they have an insurance license - so they can sell Charitable Gift Annuities and earn a commission.

I do not know if this is exactly the same, so I will wait for the official denial to confirm it.

Here Is Thrivent - All Religions and No Religion.They Manage the Tetzels Sent Out as Divinely Called Giving Counselors

"All roads lead to God," the apostates and
UOJ experts say.
"All truths are God's truth," the Thrivent
salesmen say, as they help Granny
sign away her lifetime of savings.

Thrivent sponsored this splendid stained glass window,
featuring all religions.
I am all choked up.

I would be laughing at everyone too if I could fake being a Lutheran pastor
while being the bagman for all four Lutheran sects at once -
ELCA, WELS, LCMS, and the Little Sect.
The CLC (sic) has their trotters in the trough too, but do not admit it.

WELS Coven of Predators Issues Divine Call to Thrivent Insurance Salesman

http://www.wels.net/news-events/conference-presidents-meets

The COP issued a divine call to Rev. Philip Spaude of Caspar, Wyo., to serve as a Christian giving counselor for northern Minnesota, the Dakota-Montana District, and the Pacific-Northwest District. A call was also issued to Rev. Steven Staude to serve as a semi-retired part-time Christian giving counselor for parts of western Wisconsin.

***

GJ - Thrivent Insurance subsidizes these supposed charitable efforts because every "Giving Counselor" is a licensed insurance agent who earns a commission from his sales.

What doe these holy men promote? Charitable Gift Annuities. By law, they cannot open their mouths to discuss the details unless they are licensed in that particular state. Fortunately, in some states, they have to be finger-printed, which may reduce the amount of riff-raff in the business.

Note that such details are entirely lacking in this PR news release. DP HateGood does not mind if others serve mammon, because it finances his deluxe vacation in the Caribbean each winter and many other unseen benefits not revealed to the poor people who support them in the name of mission.

Everyone is afraid to talk about this, because so much money is involved. The WELS golden calf will not tolerate anything less than complete obedience.

It works this way - Gramps and Grammy have plenty of equity but would like some cash flow in their senior years to pay for medical bills and buying sprees at Goodwill. They can get a good return on various annuity vehicles based on their declining years to live. They can get a greater percentage and some tax advantages because of the way the laws are set up.

When they sign the papers, it looks good, but they have given their assets away in an irrevocable trust.

They disinherit their heirs to the degree they give up assets.
They lose control of those assets.
They give the Giving Counselor a big fat commision, paid a few days later.

No annuity requires a medical, so someone can have a few days left to live and sign the contract. The annuity will go through with the receipt of the money.

The motivation to sell annuities/irrevocable trusts is great. The church organization wants the money and is the ultimate recipient. Thrivent wants to handle the money. The Giving Counselor wants the commission and a future career with a big list of deep pockets. He will continue to hold onto his insurance licenses and have a great start on a senior career, if he wishes.

Therefore, the whole program is rife with conflicts of interest:

• An annuity may not be the best plan for any given client.
• Thrivent is not the best financial company to use - but no choice is given to the victim customers.
• The new insurance agent does not know much about financial planning. It would take him about five years to earn a CLU designation.
• The synod is dying for the money, but is too greedy tell the truth.
• Etc.

WELS Does Work with ELCA, And Mark Jeske Will Vouch for That!Board of Directors | Thrivent Financial for Lutherans

Do all the "Planned Giving Counselors" with insurance licenses
and commissions from Thrivent count?

Board of Directors | Thrivent Financial for Lutherans:

• Board of Directors

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• Compensation Philosophy

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Board of Directors

Under the Articles of Incorporation(Link opens in new window) (PDF, 545K), the board of directors is Thrivent Financial's supreme governing body.

The board directs the management of the fraternal benefit society's affairs and has oversight responsibility in all matters involving Thrivent Financial for Lutherans.

Board Members

Brad Hewitt President and Chief Executive Officer
Frank H. Moeller Chair of the Board	Mark A. Jeske Board Member
Kenneth A. Carow Board Member	Kirk Farney Board Member
Frederick G. Kraegel Board Member	F. Mark Kuhlmann Board Member
Bonnie E. Raquet Board Member	Alice M. Richter Board Member
James H. Scott Board Member	Allan R. Spies Board Member
Adrian M. Tocklin Board Member

Contact our Board of Directors

To contact the Thrivent Financial for Lutherans Board of Directors, send a letter addressed to:

Thrivent Financial for Lutherans
Board of Directors (or name a specific director)
Office of the Corporate Secretary
625 Fourth Avenue South
Minneapolis, MN 55415

I have another version planned:
suggestions are welcome.

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Unitarian Universalists would prefer their polyamory activists keep quiet - The Washington Post

Thrivent already supports the Unitarians. Check with Brett Meyer for details.

Unitarian Universalists would prefer their polyamory activists keep quiet - The Washington Post:

Many Unitarians would prefer that their polyamory activists keep quiet

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By Lisa Miller, Published: March 22

The joke about Unitarians is that they’re where you go when you don’t know where to go. Theirs is the religion of last resort for the intermarried, the ambivalent, the folks who want a faith community without too many rules. It is perhaps no surprise that the Unitarian Universalist Association is one of the fastest-growing denominations in the country, ballooning 15 percent over the past decade, when other established churches were shrinking. Politically progressive to its core, it draws from the pool of people who might otherwise be “nones” – unaffiliated with any church at all.

But within the ranks of the UUA over the past few years, there has been some quiet unrest concerning a small but activist group that vociferously supports polyamory. That is to say “the practice of loving and relating intimately to more than one other person at a time,” according to a mission statement by Unitarian Universalists for Polyamory Awareness (UUPA). The UUPA “encourages spiritual wholeness regarding polyamory,” including the right of polyamorous people to have their unions blessed by a minister.

UUA headquarters says it has no official position on polyamory. “Official positions are established at general assembly and never has this issue been brought to general assembly,” a spokeswoman says.

But as the issue of same-sex marriage heads to the Supreme Court, many committed Unitarians think the denomination should have a position, which is that polyamory activists should just sit down and be quiet. For one thing, poly activists are seen as undermining the fight for same-sex marriage. The UUA has officially supported same-sex marriage, the spokeswoman says, “since 1979, with tons of resolutions from the general assembly.”

Conservative opponents of same-sex marriage have long used the slippery-slope argument: If states are permitted to let two men or two women marry, then what’s to stop them from giving the same privilege to two men and one woman, or two women and one man? Or six? Or 12? Once you legitimize same-sex marriage, sociologist Peter Berger wrote on his blog in 2011, “you open the door to any number of other alternatives to marriage as a union of one man and one woman: polygamous (an interesting question for Muslims in Germany and dissident Mormons in Arizona), polyandrous, polygenerational – perhaps polyspecies?”

The Unitarians are so liberal that they’re playing right into conservative hands. And the conservative blogosphere has responded predictably: First Things has taken disapproving note of the trend, as has the American Conservative.

The debate also makes the whole denomination look silly. “Unitarian Universalism is so broad-minded that it has become flat-headed,” Michael Durall, then an editor of a UUA magazine (he no longer works with UUA groups), wrote in 2004. “This is an abdication of leadership leaving Unitarian Universalism vulnerable to ridicule. Jay Leno would have a field day with this one. Do we truly want to send the message to children, youth (especially!) and adults that having multiple sexual relationships is condoned by UU churches?”

The UUPA has received its share of attention over the years – a PBS interview, a San Francisco Chronicle article – but mostly it has caused anguish and dissent among Unitarians. In 2007, a Unitarian congregation in Chestertown, Md., heard a sermon by a poly activist named Kenneth Haslam, arguing that polyamory is the next frontier in the fight for sexual and marriage freedom. “Poly folks are strong believers that each of us should choose our own path in forming our families, forming relationships, and being authentic in our sexuality.”

Over coffee last week, a friend of mine who is studying to become a Unitarian minister wondered aloud how she would feel if folks in a future congregation asked her to perform a polyamorous commitment ceremony. She is a traditionalist; she’s glad, she says, that the issue hasn’t come up.

For Lisa Miller’s previous columns, go to www.washingtonpost.com/

'via Blog this'

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By HAYLEY HARMON
6 News Anchor/Reporter

http://www.wate.com/story/21779733/knoxville-church-helping-raise-funds-for-ut-sex-week

KNOXVILLE (WATE) - The controversy continues tonight over the University of Tennessee's upcoming Sex Week.

UT Sex Week is a student-organized event covering a number of topics about sex, gender and sexuality.

After criticism from state lawmakers, the university pulled more than $11,000 worth of state funding for the event.

Now, supporters of Sex Week are working to make up that deficit, and they're getting some help from a Knoxville church.

Tennessee Valley Unitarian Universalist Church is located just down the street from UT's campus, and during their services Sunday morning, they're trying to be the best neighbors they can be.

They're donating 100 percent of the money collected during the service to help fund Sex Week.

"This is really a faith in action thing for us. The efforts of students at UT to offer that kind of programming is vitally important, and we see it as part of our ministry to support that," said Youth Religious Education Director Kim Mason, of TVUUC.

Organizers believe that open conversation about sexuality in a safe environment is essential.

"Supporting Sex Week can go a long way towards helping students better understand themselves and the community that they're in," said Mason.

TVUUC itself offers a comprehensive sex education program for members.

Church goers tell 6 News they are excited to help make Sex Week possible for UT students.

"They can choose not to have access to it. They don't have to go to any of these events, but if they want this kind of information then it should be provided," said TVUUC member Lizzie Roper, a former UT student.

Member Jeffrey Kovac, who is also a UT professor and sponsor of Sex Week, says while some of the event's content may be controversial, he sees it as necessary.

"It's true that there's some stuff that's a bit edgy, but there's a lot of stuff like talking about your virginity, how to talk to your doctor about sex, and how to talk to your parents about sex," said Kovac.

The donations from TVUUC mean a lot to Sex Week student coordinators.

"It was a really big shock to us to get that funding pulled and not get that support from our state and our administration, but then to see all these Knoxville community members help us out, it makes me feel really fulfilled," said Sex Week Co-Chair Brianna Rader.

TVUUC raised $870.62 on Sunday.

That money will go to the students behind Sex Week as early as Monday.

UT Sex Week is scheduled to take place April 5 through 12.

Sex Week is still receiving $6,700 from UT student programming money.

UT Chancellor Jimmy Cheek made the decision to withdraw the state funding.

A spokesperson for Cheek said he is not commenting beyond a released statement where he said: "We support the process and the students involved, but we should not use state funds in this manner."

He also said that the decision was Cheek's alone and that no approval process was necessary.

Campfield told 6 News Thursday that while denying state funds for Sex Week is a step in the right direction, he wants all funding to be withdrawn including the money from student programming.

"They're still using student dollars that are not something that kids have an opportunity or parents have an opportunity to opt out of," Campfield said. "I don't think that's something that the parents pay their kids tuition to go to school for."