I've visited churches belonging to all of these, with the exception of Protes'tant, but I am well aquainted (sic) with several Protes'tant families. I also know one AFLC church and its pastor quite well, but because their denomination is so decentralized, I hesitate to say I know the denomination because I know one church.
I have visited at around 100 LCMS/LCC) churches in three countries, all the way from Hong Kong and the West Coast to the East Coast, the South, both the cities and rural Midwest, and the Great Plains. I have a good idea what Missouri is like. Missouri varies greatly depending on where you are. In some places, closed communion is not normal and not expected. In some places, churches are expected not to interfere with couples living together outside of marriage. I've communed with both a Protes'ant and an ELCA friend of mine together at the same time at an LCMS church. I've listened to a band perform "Carry On Wayward Son" for the offeratory (sic). I've taken communion from a woman distributing it. Once I even saw the deaconess do the litury (sic) and preach the sermon because the pastor wasn't there.
I am only well acquainted with one LCMS church that still practices male-only sufferage (sic), but I stopped going there because the pastor is a millenalist (sic). Still, otherwise he was quite orthodox, even devoting one sermon (the 5 year anniversary of the Benke incident) to condemning that act of unionism.
I've attended conservative political action meetings in the Missouri Synod. The last one I attended featured a speaker that held pastors had the right to excommunicate by personal fiat. Not a single pastor or layman there challeged (sic) him on that point, but one old-Missourian retired district president left the meeting in protest.
How much of the Missouri Synod are you familar (sic) with. How well do your experiences really match your claim?
I'm of the view that WELS, ELS, CLC, and Protes'tant pastors are more conservative than the vast majority of LCMS pastors. All four of these all practice male-only sufferage (sic). Church Growth has only made baby steps in the ELS and its intrusion into the WELS has met widespread opposition.
Username: Random_layman
Full Name: Jojakim Dettmann
E-mail Address: lutherquest@gmail.com
Last Logged In: November 21, 2009
Registered: May 03, 2006
Total Posts: 1462
Status: Senior Member
Denomination: Wisconsin Evangelical Lutheran Synod
Positions Held (elder, pastor, layman, teacher, etc.): layman
***
GJ - Obviously he has not read this blog or FIC or paid attention to Growthism in WELS and the Little Sect on the Prairie.
2 comments:
but I stopped going there because the pastor is a millenalist
a millennialist or amillennialist? Wonder if he heard him wrong. Not everyone pronounces it AH-millenialist :)
Actually, I do read your blog from time to time, though not often because it tends to freeze my computer.
I understand your accusations. I also understand that you tend to revel in the sensational. This shifts your outlook toward others as the scandals you are aware of become the center of your vision.
I've recognized some of the same in myself and have learned to suppress it. The post you quoted from me (with permission, I will add to clear your name to the lurkers) reflects one of my weaker moments, as I quickly jotted down a list of some of the worst I have experienced in the LCMS while not mentioning the good.
The technical term for this practice is called the "Atrocity story". If you take a look at this Wikipedia article, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atrocity_story , you can learn more about it, and in doing so, better dedicate yourself to Christ rather than to justifying your past through this psychological phenomena.
As for me, I visited various WELS churches, from good to ugly, to evaluate how bad CG was in the synod, before I joined a WELS congregation. I concluded that it was not nearly severe as in the LCMS, although I made sure to expose myself to that which I know I would not like.
Since then, I have met WELS churchworkers who are very much against Church Growth. I also happen to know one of the people you write about on your blog as being a pro-CGer, and I have even heard him criticise CG.
In fact, after being WELS for a year and visiting more WELS churches than ever, I have repeatedly discovered that CG has even less support in the WELS than I thought it did before I joined.
Mr. Dettmann
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