There Is Always a UOJ Stormtrooper Lurking

Six clergy strong.
But one does not belong.

Another Successful ELCA Vote To Leave - Round 1

ELCA advisor - "It's only a few congregations, right? Bishop Hanson?
More like a few every day, every week, every month!
Oh, my aching head."


Church's first vote goes against ELCA

Immanuel Lutheran Church of Crosby

By JENNIFER STOCKINGER
Staff Writer
Members of Immanuel Lutheran Church in Crosby voted Sunday to leave the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America.

The congregation made a decision more than two months ago to vote on whether to stay or leave the ELCA after the ELCA's decision in August to allow non-celibate gay clergy into its churches.

A total of 282 parishioners voted. There were 213 in favor of leaving the ELCA and 69 who voted to remain with the ELCA.

But the congregation is not officially out of the ELCA yet. The ELCA has a process for churches to go through if they want to leave. The congregation first needed a two-thirds majority vote in order to leave the ELCA, which was accomplished Sunday. Then there is a 90-day window where the bishop and/or his delegate will consult with church members. Then there will be a second vote where again two-thirds is needed to leave. If the second vote is successful, the congregation then needs approval from the Northeastern Minnesota Synod.

Another obstacle removed from the path of future Bishop Anita Hill.

Sociological Techniques

L P has left a new comment on your post "WELS DP Version of Matthew 18: "Talk To Me First, ...":

Church Growth is nothing more but the use of sociological techniques to grow an organization. This comes from the idea that the church can be studied as a social phenomenon and based on this idea, one can conjure techniques to gather a crowd.

It is wicked because it boils down to mass manipulation.

LPC

***

GJ - LP, I attended a CG presentation where the leader kept saying, "Do this and you will have happy campers."

Ski would call that a "takeaway."

The CG leaders have said that congregational activity should be planned solely to keep members involved and happy. They need to be involved. It is all about felt needs, or, addressing the Old Adam to keep the Old Adam unconverted.

Mary Lou College Graduates and Calls

Baby X has chosen to remain anonymous.

Some have disputed what Bruce Church wrote about jobs for Mary Lou College graduates.

I thought the bureaucratic language in the WELS Report was opaque and open to various interpretations. BC often comments on the Lutheran education scene and digs up interesting statistics about it. For example, he has posted about the imaginary LCMS pastor shortage, which is used to manipulate people into going to seminary.

I heard a similar story about librarian students being yanked out of school because of the shortage of librarians. A library school professor told the story, which has yet to be verified, 23 years later. Mrs. Ichabod got a fine job as a researcher, before she was done with library school. School helped because she saw a part-time job offered on the library school bulletin board. The Exxon Valdez ran aground in Alaska soon after, and the job became full-time. The firm dealt with hazardous transport of chemicals and such matters as oil spills and platform blowouts.

For decades, anyone in the Syn Conference who has objected to Reformed doctrine, Reformed Bible translations, Reformed "worship," and synod rah-rah has been:

1. Ignored.
   
2. Slandered.
   
3. Pushed out.
   
4. Ridiculed.
   
5. Silenced.
   
6. Mocked.

Some would like a Gloryhalleluiawels blog. This is a blog where another viewpoint, refreshingly different, is offered. Three blogs have started to quash this one. Two disappeared. One sputtered to a stop.

The only reason the apostates have succeeded in the last 30 years is the passivity of the clergy. They may have elected DPs who lied about their actual position. After all, even secular politicians deceive people. Synod Presidents can do a lot of harm, but they cannot much good unless laity and clergy join in opposing falsehood.

Voting an official in or out is a small matter and not likely to make much of a difference. Constant, persistent opposition is impossible to ignore and will always have an effect. Look at how well it has worked to destroy Lutheran doctrine, in spite of all the votes, vows, solemn ceremonies, incense, albs, and Fifty Years of Grace Without the Means of Grace books.

WELS DP Version of Matthew 18: "Talk To Me First, So I Can Ignore You"

Making disciples grow in disciples who grow in making disciples.
Translation = Paying jobs for lazy apostates.

Anything attaching even a fluff of lint to Holy Mother WELS is greeted with "Matthew 18" and the beloved Eighth Commandment.

However, when someone follows WELS Talmudic Law and contacts the Doctrinal Pussycat directly, personally, and individually, the result is - No response at all. The contact is not even acknowledged.

That happens so frequently that I can only conclude they are trained to deal with doctrinal issues that way. Trained by whom? I do not know. That is why I used the passive voice.

It was true in the 1980s. I asked future DP Seifert about all the rot going on in Columbus. He suggested writing a letter to the DP. I did, and it was not even acknowledged. Next I wrote one to everyone, including the ELS SP, Orvick. DP Bob Mueller was outraged that I wrote to everyone. I said, "You never responded or even acknowledged receiving the letter."

The WELSian Matthew 18 approach allows the DP to keep the issue a secret, ignore the matter altogether, and get out his "Find him! Kill him!" stamp, to activate his hatchet-man. Everyone can view the DP as a harmless, likeable, somewhat confused man while the dissenter is confined to the nether regions, attacking him through the beloved WELS grapevine and through his own members.

Anyone can figure out that re-visiting the issue is a red flag to the easily irritated DP. The DP can then dredge up such comments as:

1. "Martin Luther complex,"
   
2. "hurting the Church" (meaning the Wisconsin sect),
   
3. and other irrelevancies.

Laity have said to me, many times, "They won't listen to me, because I am just a layman." The laity think it is because they are not highly trained clergy. I tell them, "Don't worry. They ignored me the same way, and they ignore everyone who does not agree with them."

If high priests want to cite Matthew 18, they should also welcome "Tell it to the church."

But that is wrong too. The current president of Bethany's Little Seminary said it was wrong to deal with the disgraceful conduct of a wannabee CG expert, because "It hurts the face of the church."

The Catholic bishops and the pope himself said the same thing, and look where that got them.

KJV Mark 4:22 For there is nothing hid, which shall not be manifested; neither was any thing kept secret, but that it should come abroad.

PS - Those who cite Matthew 18 do not feel hindered in any way by it.