ALPB Forum
One point that I don't remember being brought up, the debt load that students end up with at the end of college and seminary. Back in the day (I went through in the '70s) a few students, I'm sure, ended up with student loans to pay off - but nothing like what is typical today. It ends up a double wammy for pastors - longer schooling and generally a lower paying career. The debt load was not as much of a problem in previous generations of pastors.
Something to consider. One must not only consider whether the Synod (any church body) can afford to maintain the educational institutions required for the traditional parth to ordination - can the students afford the education with no assurance of a call at the end of the process and an almost guarentee that if there is a call, it will not be that well paying, especially when the student loans are figured in.
Solutions? Who do you think I am Solomon? I don't know.
Dan Fienen
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Thanks, Dan for brining (sic) that point up. One that I was surprised didn't come up earlier.
The accruement of debt is a huge factor for seminarians today. The reality is that the debt issue for potential students and students is not a question of "will I have to take out loans?" but "how much will I have to take out?". Unless one is wealthy or comes from a wealthy background i.e. has a rich relative or is a trust fund baby $20,000 is at least what he or she will come out with and that may be with considerable financial support from home congregation and home district. When I graduated from St. Louis in 2009 it was around $35,000 a year for single students (that's factoring in health insurance, car, etc.). What's sad is that I came back from vicarage my 4th year with considerable financial support. I had huge support from my home congregation and district and along with what I had saved up during vicarage. And yet I still had to take out a loan for $3,000. Basically, I entered my 4th year at the seminary with $16,000 to put towards my education and that still wasn't enough. There's something that's off here, especially considering that both seminaries recently built or are building new structures on their campuses.
ScottG
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| Robert Preus had a plan to eliminate student loan debt, so they caned him and canned him. |
2 comments:
It must be hard being Rev Steven W Bohler, one of the few consciences left in the LCMS. Ichabodians know it's next to impossible to get UOJers to think that they might have every done something wrong, though they might give lip service to the idea during the liturgy. After all, everyone is forgiven of every sin before they were even born, they think.
Rev Bohler was the one who filed the a complaint about DP Benke over the Yankee Stadium deal, so it's odd that he comments on the same blog page as Benke did recently.
So DP Benke thanks Dr. Jackson for objective cost data on the seminaries, but thinks that any mention of Walther ripping off a seminary student (Stephan's son) of his family fortune has no bearing on the matter. Hasn't Benke heard of the apple not falling far from the tree proverb? Does he not admit he is a spiritual descendant of Walther (Mt 23:31)?
So, even though the UOJers fend off blame by pointing to the LCMS's distributed authority system whenever it's convenient (i.e., everyone and no one's at fault for selling the seminarians into Egypt a la Joseph via student loans), Rev. Bohler suggests that the situation is tragic and maybe not so blame-free:
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DP Benke Noticed the Tuition Comparison, Jan 24, 2012
http://ichabodthegloryhasdeparted.blogspot.com/2012/01/dp-benke-noticed-tuition-comparison.html
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Bohler and Benke meet before post-9-11:
http://www.nytimes.com/2002/02/08/nyregion/seeing-heresy-service-for-sept-11-pastor-under-fire-for-interfaith-prayers.html?pagewanted=all
Rev. Steven Bohler, pastor at Our Savior's Lutheran Church in Crookston, Minn., who said he wrote asking for an investigation of Mr. Benke.
Rev. Bohler:
http://locator.lcms.org/nworkers_frm/w_detail.asp?W118726
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Benke, Bohler et al at the ALPB Forum:
http://www.alpb.org/forum/index.php?topic=4272.90
...how much blame do we attach to him and how much do we attach to those who advised him to go to seminary under such circumstances?...Then to have the same church body that told them "come, study, trust" now tell them that they showed poor judgment and that such may be grounds for removal from the very office for which he sunk himself and his family into life-long debt? Sad is an understatement.
The Underground Railroad: LCMS Student Loan
Debt Slaves Escape to Canada:
http://ichabodthegloryhasdeparted.blogspot.com/2012/01/underground-railroad-lcms-student-loan.html
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