Wednesday, February 16, 2011

Stealth Calendar at The CORE.
Does This Need Commentary?



The CORE
Events from one or more calendars could not be shown here because you do not have the permission to view them. 

***

GJ - One of the more glaring defects of WELS Church and Change is the need for secrecy. People ask in vain:
  1. Where are copies of these plagiarized sermons from Groeschel? After all, Groeschel himself stated that pastors should give him credit for copying his original work.
  2. What pastoral conference was attended in Seattle, since WELS held no conferences at all that week?
  3. Who is funding this extravagant pipeline from Groeschel's LifeChurch.tv? Shouldn't the Methodists kick in some money for promoting Methodism?
  4. The Change or Die! brochure brags that Ski has 300 people each Sunday evening. How many are WELS members from the area? If services were held Sunday morning, how many would attend?
  5. Apart from Daddy Warbucks, what is the giving there? Can this model work in other areas - having a vanity project that burns up oodles of money to gather members from the same synod for evening rock music?

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old-curmudgeon (http://old-curmudgeon.myopenid.com/) has left a new comment on your post "Stealth Calendar at The CORE.Does This Need Commen...":

Stealth too often means untrustworthy.


***

GJ - For sure, Old Curmudgeon. Most churches promote everything on their calendars rather than hiding them. The CORE's sermon titles were listed far in advance, which is how people connected them so easily with Groeschel's.

Pastor Samelson Asked the Intrepids

Change or Dye!
Norma Boeckler thought the yolk-colored hair was a bit much.



Pastor Jeff Samelson said...


I guess what I was most curious about with the advertising for this conference was not the influence on "tuned-in Confessional Lutherans" (of which readers of Ichabod would presumably be a subset) but rather its influence on, well, those who wouldn't necessarily know any better -- both individuals and churches within confessional bodies and those within other Lutheran denominations (like ELCA). In other words, how many people would find out about such a conference and come to the conclusion, "Oh, isn't it nice to see all these different Lutherans united in such a worthy endeavor!"

I'm guessing you wouldn't want to handle it here in the comments section, but it occurred to me that you (IL) might wish to anticipate and answer various questions and counter-arguments by spelling out what makes participation by a WELS pastor in a conference like "Change or Die" different from participation in something like the "Confessional Christian Worldview" Seminars that were held in various WI and MN locations in the last decade (I'm not aware that they're still being held, but they could be); these included both WELS/ELS and non-WELS/ELS speakers and were advertised outside WELS and ELS, as well. (I'm assuming that you would not have found fault with those seminars, as I don't recall hearing any criticism of them from confessional sources.)


***

GJ - The message WELS, Missouri, and the Little Sect have been giving for decades is this -

ELCA's (ALC/LCA/AELC) confession of faith does not matter to us at all. We can work together. We don't mind your health insurance paying for the abortions of your church workers. Not at all. 


Gay clergy? You should see Party in the MLC!


There are many legalists in our midst. They do not understand the Gospel or our need to work together. We appreciate your help in keeping these joint efforts a secret. Word got out from a certain writer, now a legalistic blogger, that we were working together. Thanks to you, we tamped that down. In fact, no one really believes how much we do together. 


Love and kisses, always - the Syn Conference.

Public Rebuke of Pastors “Ski” and Jeske « Light from Light

Public Rebuke of Pastors “Ski” and Jeske « Light from Light

Additional comments are published at this blog's address.

Intrepids Ask about Change or Die!



Pastor Jeff Samelson said... How has this "Change or Die" conference been advertised? I hadn't heard anything about it, but that doesn't surprise me, as I'm on the East Coast.

Is this the kind of thing that only a select group would have been invited to, or something that was widely advertised among Wisconsin or Midwestern Lutherans?

I'm curious both as to the impact of the advertising/influence of this event in the church at large and, I guess, how IL were made aware of it.
Rev. Paul A. Rydecki said...
The conference is advertised for the world to see at the Siebert Foundation website. I don't know how they actively advertise it, but apparently it's not the first such conference, since it says this on their registration form: "This event is intended for church pastors and their leadership. Due to the overwhelming response to last year’s event and limited seating, we are restricting reservations to church pastors (we will accept more than one pastor from a single church) and one member of their leadership team. Seating is limited to 270 people. Registration is on a first-come basis." The influence on the "church at large" of such a conference should be obvious. 270 pastors and church leaders take "Lutheran" ministry ideas into their congregations and implement them there. Assuming an average of two participants per congregation, and using Pastor Ski's average Sunday attendance of 300, that's roughly 40,000 churchgoers who are directly influenced by this conference. From there, the ideas (and corresponding theology) that are implemented in one place are heralded in neighboring congregations and throughout a synod as "effective," and the influence rapidly spreads. Pastor Ski and Pastor Jeske, for example, have been the keynote speakers and/or presenters at numerous WELS (and LCMS) events in the recent past and are scheduled to be keynote speakers and/or presenters at several WELS (and/or LCMS) events in the near future. Add to that the Time of Grace viewership and listening audience, and the impact is even greater. And let's not pretend that there isn't a rather popular blog out there called Ichabod that spreads the news about events like this. You can't advertise something on the internet and pretend it's "our little secret."

***

GJ - I was not the first to discover this conference, but I was only too happy to provide the link and the actual brochure for everyone to see. Some things have a way of disappearing in the midst of a chorus of denials.

One of many researchers for Ichabod said, "If I give it to my pastor, one person knows. If I give it to Ichabod, everyone knows."

The moment something is posted via a Google tool, it is part of the Google search results. Some activities published another way may take a little longer to register. Certain areas are rich in target opportunities, and some names are  easy to associate with apostasy. Nothing is really private on the Net.

On another topic, a researcher noted the power of blogs:

bruce-church (https://bruce-church.myopenid.com/) has left a new comment on your post "Burkee Book Review in Christian News Latest Issue":

The three Midwest Lutheran synods are going through the same democratization phase as the Arab world is now. Before the Arab world had govts and carefully controlled opposition groups. That's similar to our synods and the opposition led by Otten. But now anyone can blog about the synod and connect with like-minded Lutherans, similar to Mideast denizens using Facebook to topple tyrants. It should lead to a more informed synod so that the pastors and congregants get the reforms they want, and what the synods need. For instance, I think that the LCMS should follow the LCC's lead in how they keep seminary education affordable. First, they cover 25% of their seminaries' expenses. Second, due to the recession, the LCC is going to merge its two seminaries into one seminary with two campuses. There will only be one administration and the faculties will each be cut by 50%, and they'll have to do more online distance teaching. The LCMS could do the same, and reduce tuition by half down to LCC levels. Then require that all pastors get an M Div before they receive their fist call, end the SMP program, and require all SMPs to get an M Div by some set date:

Latest News:
http://www.brocku.ca/concordiaseminary/

Burkee Book Review in Christian News Latest Issue

J. A. O. Preus, aka Chairman JAO, aka The Two Natures of Jack Preus, 
is still a fascinating topic for Lutherans.


I sent my review of the Burkee book to Herman Otten, so I am not going to complain and act shocked that "he copied it without permission!" That tactic has been used many times, by Paul McCain and many others.

I agree with Justice Brandeis that "sunlight is the best disinfectant." I support any effort to publish what is happening in the Lutheran Church, which is Lutheran no longer.

Almost all the Lutheran blogs are political, which means they debate meaningless topics and prance around the real issues. No one wants to poke holes in a ship made of cardboard.

Jack and Robert Preus were both politicians, no less than Tietjen or Franklin C. Fry. The Preus brothers were also theologians. Their lasting contribution will be their high visibility support for traditional Lutheran doctrine, including the authority and inerrancy of the Scriptures. They never stopped their efforts.

Ralph Bohlmann earned a PhD at Yale, published a book, and did little after that.

Jack Preus published translations of Chemnitz and hauled the Second Martin out of the dustbin of Lutheran dogmatics. When Jack died, his biography of Chemnitz was published. He could have spent his retirement years fishing and hunting moose, but he wrote another book. The LCMS apostates neutralized him as much as possible in office, but he never stopped being a theologian.

Have you read any books by Tietjen lately? Jungkuntz? McCain?

Robert was also pushed out of office, with the help of former allies Waldo Werning and Ralph Bohlmann. Werning was Agent X at Christian News. But Robert continued as a theologian, even when Missouri was busy trashing him. I know he was a rascal. I had my own experience involving his deviousness, but that is par for all church leaders today. The rest of them are not theologians.

Robert finished his life by publishing a book, Justification and Rome, which tried to warn Missouri against poping. His own seminary has been turning out Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox priests ever since, sometimes a few minutes after graduating.  

Justification and Rome is also a clear repudiation of UOJ. I wish he had been clearer, but his manuscript was edited by Dan and Rolf, who never grew beyond their MDivs and never became theologians.

The UOJ Stormtroopers still cannot deal with Robert's last book, and Chemnitz is still largely ignored. Nevertheless, the impact  of Jack and Robert Preus remains. The seeds sown will grow and the Gospel leaven will permeate the lump of dough.

For all his faults, universally confessed to cover up the truth about Lutheran apostasy, Herman Otten has doggedly published a lot of material. The quirky but inexpensive CN Encyclopedia gathered tons of information I used for Out of the Depths of ELCA. I also used a tall stack of The LCA's The Lutheran magazine, saved by my mother, to show what was going on. Moving from thousands of facts to a book is an arduous process. I remember typing that book on a German portable typewriter as Mrs. Ichabod brought me food. ELCA hated it. WELS hated it. The LCA and ALC responded with silence, and nothing happened.

All the implications of the merger were published in that special issue, 1987, before the merger was consummated. Now the prophets of ELCA are donning their martyr robes and speaking out about the suffering they have endured, after ignoring all the doctrinal matters (and gay quotas!) for 24 years. I especially enjoy my first LCA bishop leading the troops out of ELCA. Shorty Sauer was the chairman of the conference of bishops, a potential candidate for ELCA Archbishop.

What did Sauer know and when did he know it?

This photo captures the weariness I saw in Robert before he died. Johnson, the plagiarizing St. Louis seminary president, played games with him, as he did with Otten. Johnson pretended to hire Preus for a summer session and then took it back.
No one will write a book about Johnson.