Sunday, April 28, 2013

What Does That Priest Think He is? A Member of the Hyles Cult?

He married Hyles' daughter, cheated outrageously on her,
just as her dad cheater on her mother.
Read here about the Jack Hyles' clan.
List of Hyles' cult's crimes.

bruce-church (https://bruce-church.myopenid.com/) has left a new comment on your post "The Woody Woodpecker Debate Rages On: Pileated or ...":

Showing that there is diversity in the Catholic church hierarchy (sexual diversity, that is), a monk has been arrested and charged for trying to abduct teen girls for sex in northern Illinois.

In a statement, SNAP’s Director, John Pilmaier says: “Thomas
Benedictine monk assigned to retreat center between Milwaukee and Chicago arrested for trying to pick up teen girls:

http://fox6now.com/2013/04/28/snap-benedictine-monk-from-milw-archdiocese-charged/

Chmura, a Benedictine monk assigned in the Archdiocese of Milwaukee was arrested on Thursday for attempting to abduct a 14-year-old girl in Antioch, Illinois. Chmura informed police that he approached the child because he wanted sexual gratification. He further admitted to law enforcement officials that he had attempted similar child abductions up to 10 times in the past six weeks.”

St. Benedict’s Abbey Retreat Center:

http://www.johnpaul2center.org/LayFormation/ResourceGuide/RetreatCenters/StBenedictsAbbey.htm

-------------

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sistine_Chapel

When the Pope's own Master of Ceremonies Biagio da Cesena said "it was mostly disgraceful that in so sacred a place there should have been depicted all those nude figures, exposing themselves so shamefully, and that it was no work for a papal chapel but rather for the public baths and taverns,"

20 Nude youth in Sistine chapel:

http://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/arts/artwork/sistine-chapel-michelangelo-paintings13.htm


The Woody Woodpecker Debate Rages On:
Pileated or Acorn Woodpecker?

The pileated woodpecker is known for its loud knocking sound
as it hammers for insects or chisels out his nest.


Lara Bailey has left a new comment on your post "The Pileated Woodpecker Sighted Again":

actually the acorn woodpecker was the inspiration for woody. I was confused too since they both have that tuft of red on their heads.Great article anyway, keep up the good work! :-)

***

GJ - Some scholars believe Woody is indeed modeled after the acorn woodpecker, according to this story on NPR.

Several of them happened to know the truth and had discussed it at length, in between identifying puzzling shorebirds, curating museum collections and writing books and stuff like that. It turns out that Walter Lantz, the animator who created Woody Woodpecker, had personally given Garrett a copy of his biography, and in that book it says that Walter and his wife, Grace, while honeymooning in a California cabin, were amused by an acorn woodpecker who was poking nuts under the roof shingles. They liked the "little raucous scream" the bird emitted. Grace said to Walter, "Why don't you make him into a character?"

That may be true of the call of the cartoon character. But bird-watchers will  back me up in saying the first Woody cartoon figure looked more like a pileated, which are rarely seen because of their wide-ranging habitat. I think the pileated is a ham, because he posed for me the first time and also for our friends when he was spotted. 

Here is the very first Woody Woodpecker cartoon, which was found by our over-worked research department. He did not look like an acorn woodpecker. He looked like a pileated.

The acorn woodpecker sounds are found here. The last two calls sound more like the Woody Woodpecker theme, allowing for creative expression.

The acorn woodpecker had the raucous song that attracted the honeymooners.


I thought my suet was drawing the pileated, but they are also keen on the acorn woodboring beetle, which was feasting on our dying oaks in Bella Vista. The drought killed the very tree we saw the pileated feasting upon. As the readers know, a compromised tree will become a great place for insects to dine.

Most birds will fly away when spotted, except for the brave little hummingbirds, who deliberately approach their friends. In Phoenix I often had them buzz by me, thanking me for all the friendly cover and food I provided. Once or twice I was able to provide a shower with my garden hose, as it flew back and forth for a bath.

The pileated woodpecker post remains in the top five of the all-time favorites on Ichabod:

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We love woodpeckers because they are great insect eaters, whether they are downy, hairy, pileated, acorn, or flickers

Insect eating birds appreciate suet feeders, which are inexpensive and last awhile. I used to get suet for almost nothing, but now I have to buy little cakes of it or larger bags. Starlings love suet because they are also insect eaters. A gardener always wants insect eaters settling down in his yard.

We have four living and two dead trees in the back yard, one large tree in the front yard.


Cantate Sunday - The Fourth Sunday after Easter. John 16:5-15.
Of Sin Because They Believe Not on Me

 



Cantate, The Fourth Sunday after Easter, 2013


Pastor Gregory L. Jackson


Bethany Lutheran Church, 10 AM Central Time


The Hymn #458   Our Father – Luther                         4:50 
The Confession of Sins
The Absolution
The Introit p. 16
The Gloria Patri
The Kyrie p. 17
The Gloria in Excelsis
The Salutation and Collect p. 19
The Epistle and Gradual       
The Gospel              
Glory be to Thee, O Lord!
Praise be to Thee, O Christ!
The Nicene Creed p. 22
The Sermon Hymn #462                I Love Thy Kingom                4:21 

This World’s Prince Is Judged

The Communion Hymn #305            Soul Adorn Thyself             4:23
The Preface p. 24
The Sanctus p. 26
The Lord's Prayer p. 27
The Words of Institution
The Agnus Dei p. 28
The Nunc Dimittis p. 29
The Benediction p. 31
The Hymn #657                           Beautiful Savior                    4:24                 

Fourth Sunday After Easter

Lord God, heavenly Father, who didst through Thy Son promise us Thy Holy Spirit, that He should convince the world of sin, of righteousness, and of judgment: We beseech Thee, enlighten our hearts, that we may confess our sins, through faith in Christ obtain everlasting righteousness, and in all our trials and temptations retain this consolation, that Christ is Lord over the devil and death, and all things, and that He will graciously deliver us out of all our afflictions, and make us forever partakers of eternal salvation, through the same, Thy Son, Jesus Christ, our Lord, who liveth and reigneth with Thee and the Holy Ghost, one true God, world without end. Amen.

KJV James 1:16 Do not err, my beloved brethren. 17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. 18 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures. 19 Wherefore, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath: 20 For the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God. 21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.

KJV John 16:5 But now I go my way to him that sent me; and none of you asketh me, Whither goest thou? 6 But because I have said these things unto you, sorrow hath filled your heart.

7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 Of sin, because they believe not on me; 10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more; 11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged. 12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. 13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. 14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you. 15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.


http://ichabodthegloryhasdeparted.blogspot.com/2013/04/norma-boecklers-new-book-treasury-of.html

This World’s Prince Is Judged

KJV John 16:5 But now I go my way to him that sent me; and none of you asketh me, Whither goest thou? 6 But because I have said these things unto you, sorrow hath filled your heart.

The context of this sermon is after the Last Supper. The disciples know that a crisis is looming. Thomas said that journeying toward Jerusalem would be equal to dying together.

Lenski:
Already in 14:28 Jesus had told the disciples that he was going to his Father. When he now calls the Father “him that did send me,” the sense is the same save that now the mission of Jesus is specifically mentioned: Jesus returning to his Sender, having completed his mission and the visible stay on earth which it required. He goes to his Sender in order to make report to him of his successful task. When saying that he is returning to his Sender, Jesus makes a basic statement, one that governs all that follows in this chapter.
The addition: “and none of you inquires of me, Where art thou going?” while it is joined with “and,” is adversative, “and yet.” Strange to say—and Jesus says it with a touch of gentle reproof and of pain in his own heart—not one of the eleven makes a request of him as to where he is going.
Lenski, R. C. H.: The Interpretation of St. John's Gospel. Minneapolis, MN : Augsburg Publishing House, 1961, S. 1078.

There is an interesting transition in this powerful passage, as Lenski teaches. The disciples should be asking about where Jesus is going because what follows will comfort and guide them. In sorrow, they do not ask. That is our normal reaction when we face bad news – we do not want to hear more. We would rather deny it or put it off a little longer.

7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

It would difficult for any group to think about the world-wide spread of the Gospel at this stage of sorrow. And yet, that is one theme in this message. Jesus earthly ministry meant that the Gospel was limited to His travels in one tiny outpost of the Roman Empire. Soon the Spirit would move the disciples to take the Gospel around the civilized world, by creating centers of the Faith that would copy the New Testament and spread it even farther, with local pastors taking over for the apostles.

In the last century Christians have neglected the doctrine of the Holy Spirit in many different ways. For that reason Pentecostalism and the Charismatic Movement have stepped in to replace the vacuum.

One Form of Neglect
The Scriptures have been treated as an ordinary, man-made book. That is the majority opinion among mainline, Left-wing denominations. The extent of fiddling with the manuscripts and the translations has meant the same for the so-called conservative denominations as well.

Why would someone seriously study a book written by men, a book with a constantly changing message?

Another Form of Neglect
Congregations and denominations have assumed that the Word of God has no power at all unless man can find some way to make it attractive and appealing to human reason and emotion. The drive to sell the Gospel by making it a secular coaching tool is another way of saying that the Word of God must satisfy the carnal appetites of man – What’s in it for me?

What This Theme Means
The direct connection between the Word and the Spirit means that we never question the power of the Holy Spirit when someone is faithful to the Bible, which is the only book written, published, and protected by God Himself. No other book has that claim; therefore, the Bible judges all books.

This truth satisfies the questions of:
  1. Do I have the Holy Spirit? Yes – faith in Christ shows that someone has the Spirit, because faith is a creation of the Spirit through the Word.
  2. Do I know the truth even when everyone denies it and teaches against it? Yes, because the true Word of God never changes, even though man changes.
  3. Am I forgiven? Yes – if someone has faith in Christ alone for salvation, that individual is justified by the Spirit/Word and saved for eternal life.

God’s plan is to expand the Gospel message throughout the world, so the departing of Christ will mean the sending of the Spirit. And this includes, as we know, the actual resurrection of Christ.

He was raised for our justification - His actual rising from the dead, before the Tomb was opened, shows us the reality of our own eternal life. When we grieve for someone who has died before us, we always keep in mind the risen Savior. How can this be, that we are promised eternal life? We remember the resurrection of Christ and that strengthens our faith.

http://ichabodthegloryhasdeparted.blogspot.com/2013/04/norma-boecklers-new-book-treasury-of.html


James 1:21 wrote:

receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.

This half-verse is a classic passage on the efficacy of the Word. Receive is used as a synonym for believe, and it expresses the Biblical concept of faith/trust very well. Faith or trust is not a decision and not a merit or virtue. Faith means receiving what God offers as the truth (with abundant Promises and prophetic evidence).

Engrafted is a fine agricultural word. When we splice two plants together they have the nature of both. Most roses are a hybrid graft on a wild rose root. That give the rose the staying power of the wild rose and the beauty of the hybrid. Most roses have that lump which betrays the graft.

The Gospel Word is grafted onto us, received in faith. This Word is the Holy Spirit’s power behind faith and justification, forgiveness and salvation.

The arrogant, proud, and self-righteous do not have faith. They reject faith and have no meekness. By not receiving with meekness they deny to themselves the grace that comes from the Gospel Promises.

The Holy Spirit’s work in three Words

8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 Of sin, because they believe not on me; 10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more; 11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

Some time ago, these verses really tied me up in a knot. They were so simple and yet I had to struggle to see the complete message. Luther said in one of his sermons about this lesson – it is a fine lesson but it takes fine readers to understand it.

As he realized, most of the world reading this passage rejected its meaning. How can something so simple on the surface be so complex and powerful? That of course is the strength of John’s Gospel – a profound message expressed in child-like simplicity, with many repetitions.

9 Of sin, because they believe not on Me;

What is sin? Most people will define sin as actions. And they have a hierarchy of sins. The worst is criticizing the synod, according to various synods, because that is a sin against the Holy Spirit (no forgiveness!) I am not kidding. One parson said, “I cannot disagree with the circuit pastor, because the Holy Spirit put him in that office.” The same is said about other political functionaries, who have no trouble arguing against the Word. Because. They. Know. Greek.

The world knows what sin is. All the messages of this age are about sin. Do you fail to recycle? Sin. Do you oppose every kind of marriage? Sin. Do you own a gun? Sin. Do you believe in traditional values? Sin.

Christians have quite a few definitions too, all based on actions and attitudes. Did you play the pipe organ of a non-WELS church? Sin.

But all this is thrown aside in a few words from Jesus. And John gave us these sermons as essential supplements to Matthew-Mark-Luke. Essential – not extra credit read. So essential that we should especially take the Johannine words to our hearts as the elder Apostle’s final testimony, for the salvation of all who believe.

Sin is not believing on Jesus. I am going to use the old wording because too many people think faith is just thinking Jesus is a good Teacher and perhaps even the Savior. They have some knowledge of Jesus but also hedge their bets with their trust in their own righteousness.

In those few words Jesus rejected the world’s definition of sin and the false teacher’s version of sin. If your church is not growing, you are sinful!

But those words also toss us into the abyss when we realize their complete meaning. When we harbor doubts and anxieties about past sins, we fail to believe on Jesus, who has taken all sins upon Himself.

Continuing regret, remorse, sorrow, and anxiety is making a side-bet. I will show my true contrition by clinging to the thought of not being completely forgiven until I am perfect and free of sin. But that fulfills the meaning of this verse. That is THE sin – not believing in God’s complete, full, free forgiveness through faith in Christ.

Were you not a perfect child or a perfect parent? Sin is not imperfection, a weakness we all have. Sin is not believing in our complete forgiveness. We cannot lay a side-bet on our future perfection, which really paves the road to repetition. All the gurus have proven this by making their law the savior and driving people right back to the same thing (food, addiction, etc). And when people come back for another dose of the law, the guru says, “See, you need me.”

http://ichabodthegloryhasdeparted.blogspot.com/2013/04/norma-boecklers-new-book-treasury-of.html


10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father and ye see me no more

I had a lot of trouble with this. What is the connection? The constant debate over justification and many great Scriptural insights from others have helped me see the connection.

Righteousness is God’s forgiveness or justification by faith. This is the great comfort to be offered by the Paraclete (Advocate). The Gospel will be declared across the world and spread as the first social network came into being. Jesus designed it, saying,

Take advantage of hospitality. When you are invited into a home, speak about the Gospel. If they receive you and listen to the Word, they receive Me, since I am conveyed by the Word of God. If they reject you, they do not reject you but Me, the One who sent you. Knock the dust off your shoes and move on.
The Spirit will convict the world of forgiveness because the teaching of the Resurrection will plant faith in the hearts of people across the world.

The risen Savior was seen and heard by hundreds of people, who established the Gospel everywhere, found themselves persecuted, and traveled on to establish it in new places, often in world ports where the Gospel would travel even faster. In essence, Jesus friended 500 people in addition to the Twelve, and He certainly had believers among those He healed. Since all of them witnessed to the resurrection, the Christian faith spread across the Roman Empire in one generation.

Luther is one who was convicted of righteousness. As he said in one sermon, the entire world would be forgiven IF every single person believed on Jesus Christ. But they do not. So we can preach about the possibility, due to God’s Promises, but not about the reality, because many do NOT believe, and many fall away from faith in Christ.

Righteousness comes to us through faith, and Jesus is consistent in all His teaching about that truth.

Therefore the wisdom of the world and all the teachers is thrown aside in a few words. That is why there will always be great hatred about faith in Christ, constant disruption and anger, especially among the self-righteous religious leaders, whether they are the Pharisees of the past or the synodical drones of the present.

John 16:11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

This message can be treated under the topic of faith but it is especially good here at the end of the triad.

Christ is teaching – Satan may rule this world and define all that is good, holy, honored, and worshiped, but he is judged, condemned, and nearing his final destruction. Do not adhere to those things he honors and upholds. He is condemned for eternity.

And yet – I see this in the church – members and pastors in larger churches think they are really something based on material measures – money, local prestige, synodical honors, and so forth. And they brag about everything except being faithful to the Word of God.

Only in America could a church brag about being 150 years old. In Europe some are 1,000 years old. Some are so big that one can hardly see the altar from the balcony. So much marble and gold that tourists gasp.


All wordly wisdom is Satan’s. All the best scientists trust in evolution, not Creation. Don’t you want to be among the best, the wisest, the most up to date?


25. But now, since the prince of this world and the Holy Spirit, the kingdom of Christ and the kingdom of the devil, are directly opposed to one another, and the Holy Spirit is not willing that anyone should parade his own deeds and praise himself on account of them, the holy cross must soon follow. The world will not consent to be reprimanded for its blindness. Therefore one must willingly submit and suffer persecution. If we have the right kind of faith in our hearts, we must also open our mouths and confess righteousness and make known sin. Likewise we must condemn and punish the doings of this world and make it known that everything it undertakes, is damned. For this we must be considered heretics, and must pass through the fire. They say: This is against the holy councils and the canon of the holy father, the pope. Then you are to answer: How can I help it? Here it stands — the text does not say the Holy Spirit is to convict them and say their doctrine is error, blindness and the government of the devil. This, of course, they will not endure, but would have us call them gracious noblemen. Therefore, one must here risk his neck.

26. These are the three parts we have in this Gospel lesson: Sin is unbelief; righteousness is faith; the judgment is the holy cross. Therefore give heed and learn to consider everything that is without the Spirit as nothing and as condemned, and afterwards be prepared for the holy cross that thou must suffer on account of it. Now follows in the Gospel further: “I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he shall guide you into all the truth.”

http://ichabodthegloryhasdeparted.blogspot.com/2013/04/norma-boecklers-new-book-treasury-of.html


So many people say, “I would speak the truth and not hedge it, but my family would be angry. My church friends would stop speaking to me. My ecclesiastical bosses would shun me.”

“I must have said something wrong or said it in the wrong way, because everyone wants my scalp.”

That is a measure of the truth. In one setting the truth will make convicts cry and repent. In another setting it will make the self-righteous furious and full of vindictiveness.

12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. 13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. 14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you. 15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

This is another great section, because we can see the wisdom and compassion of Christ. He is not going to tell them too much because their capacity is not great enough to grasp all of it.

How did they record such harmonious Gospels, four in all? The Holy Spirit came to them as promised and stirred up their memories so that their words were divinely in accord. The Gospels and Letters became the foundation of the Church, an unchanging standard or norm for the Christian faith.

Jesus received from the Father and taught it to the apostles. The apostles received from Jesus and the Holy Spirit and taught it to the early church in preaching and teaching, to us in the written Word of God.

http://ichabodthegloryhasdeparted.blogspot.com/2013/04/norma-boecklers-new-book-treasury-of.html

Imposing the Mafia Rule on Twissted Sister.
Bedfellows Cannot Be Criticized

WELS District President Don Patterson -
come to Holy Word for the drunken spiritual retreats,
stay for Church and Change fellowship with Mark Jeske.


twissted_sisster has left a new comment on your post "WELS Works with These Blokes - LGTB Retreat. Expos...":

"The ELCA 1991 Social Statement on the Death Penalty declared “we oppose the death penalty.”

But yet they sanction a path to eternal damnation. The fact that they label themselves Lutheran must have Martin spinning in his grave.

***

GJ - It is my melancholy duty to impose the most basic rule of the Mafia on the WELS-LCMS-ELS-CLC combine.

Bedfellows cannot be criticized, cannot be prosecuted.

The Mafia does favors for businessmen and politicians for one reason alone - to bind those people to their criminal enterprises for life. They always taint their legitimate friends with their crimes, so the two become one. Once serviced by the Mob, the putative honest citizen can no longer speak against the Mafia.

Twissted has violated this rule, which is honored in the breech among Lutherans. WELS, the Little Sect on the Prairie, and the haughty LCMS work with the ELCA. "Yea even," as Walther often said, the CLC (sic) has done the same.

I have enumerated those ELCA religious projects so many times that page-views could remain at an all-time high simply from people doing a bit of Ichabod research on the topic. Projects with ELCA include:

  • Lutheran World Relief.
  • Evangelism (Church Growth, which ain't evangelism, so maybe it doesn't count).
  • The Joy religious radio program.
  • The Membership Initiative.
  • Snowbird Leadership Conference.
  • Multi-Culturalism Project (hatched at Snowbird) - multi-cultural includes pan-sexual.
  • Higher education.


Justification by Faith
Looking the other way about ELCA's profound love for abortion, the so-called conservative Lutherans share the same exact (wrong) take on justification. They all agree, 99.999% of Lutherans, that God in His grace has forgiven the entire world, so the entire world has been saved. People just need to hear the joyous news that they are already forgiven and saved. That is The Gospel for American Lutherans today, even though their own documents and Confessions repudiate Universalism.

The entire Bible is a sermon about Jesus, as Luther said, and the Bible's only purpose is to teach Jesus, plant faith in Jesus, and sustain that faith. The power of the Holy Spirit in the Word is revealed in its power to bring God's grace to us through the Means of Grace.

That old apostate rationalist went to Halle University and taught there?
And ELCA-WELS-LCMS were spawned by Halle grads?
Tell me more.


Listen to a Liberal Theology Veteran
I read hundreds of theology books as a graduate student in theology at Notre Dame. Most of them were mainline Protestant theology books from the famous academics of the 19th and 20th centuries: Harnack, Schleiermacher, Barth, Tillich, and many more.

I also studied the Life of Jesus authors, the rationalists who wrote large volumes about what they did not believe, from Reimarus and Schleiermacher on to the Jesus Project of recent times.

Feel free to read all those books, attend the lectures, and write the papers. I can save you a lot of trouble.

The mainline liberal apostates agree about one essential dogma - Never, ever make faith contingent. Five words sum it up. When faith is contingent, there is no grace, they claim. Does that start to sound familiar? Just like UOJ calling faith a work?

But what about Paul or Jesus or the Holy Spirit?


KJV Romans 4:21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform. 22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness. 23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him; 24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead; 25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Unbelievers do not want to hear "if we believe." It is like the noonday sun shining on a sunburn. It hurts  terribly.

That is why the SynCons work with ELCA - they are unbelievers united by the same dogma. Therefore, the SynCons are far worse than ELCA, where the apostasy is confessed in writing and taught openly.







Facebook Discussion about Koine Crowding Chancel Easter Sunday

St. Peter WELS, Freedom, Wisconsin.
Main sanctuary, Easter Sunday.
Tim Glende.
"I pulled my coat tight,
against the calling crowd."
https://www.facebook.com/LivinTheHylife/posts/10201221419400416?comment_id=76755537&offset=0&total_comments=57&notif_t=share_reply

  • Come to the WELS!
    Photo
    2Like ·  · Unfollow Post · 

    • Steve Spencer If what is seen completely contradicts what is preached, that's a very mixed message. The Word is truly all-powerful, but why burden it with such tripe? Foolish!
      14 hours ago · Like · 6
    • Austin Becker The focus should be on Christ. If you must have a worship band, either have them pre-record and use a CD during worship, or else have them play *in the back*. They should not be front and centre like this.
      14 hours ago · Like · 1

    • Mike Westendorf I know the guys from Koine and they are outstanding Lutheran Christians. They have worked hard and well to bring the old language of hymns to light to a culture that doesn't understand the organ. I am often amazed at the astounding lack of grace that often comes from WELS Christians on this matter. Take a picture, out of context and then smear the people involved whom you do not know. These people bleed for the church and desire for everyone to know the truth of God's word more deeply and yet Christians, bible believing, conservative Lutheran Christians will be so quick to engage in this kind of public commentary against fellow brothers. I pray that we can show the world grace and mercy better than we do our own people.
      14 hours ago · Edited · Like · 13
    • Alan G. Sides Only symbols anyway.
      14 hours ago · Like · 2
    • Steve Spencer Doesn't "understand" the organ? Huh, what?! Work smart phones, and Windows 8, but can't "understand" the organ?!?!? That's really lame. Kids today are way smarter than that! Crazy!
      14 hours ago · Edited · Like · 6
    • Melissa Brander Well said Mike. It is one thing to recognize that this is not a way you want to worship. Which is fine, everyone is allowed freedom to worship in their own styles. It's another thing to tell other people they are wrong for worshipping this way, when God's word is still being preached and is still at the heart and center. I don't think God cares how we worship as long as we are worshipping Him and Him alone.
      14 hours ago · Like · 5
    • Melissa Brander Nick Brander because you should see this.

    • Amalia Campbell I was at this "service" - all singing and scripture readings, plus an offering and benediction at the end. There was a very short maybe 5 min sermon, but it completely lacked any kind of confession and absolution. If it had been called a concert then it would have been a wonderful way to worship, but as something that took the place of all three services at this church and lacked a confession and the reassurance of forgiveness, I believe this is unacceptable. And the pastor was the man in red, which means that while he was not in the pulpit, he was still up there leading his congregation.
      13 hours ago · Edited · Unlike · 6
    • Dan A Dome Everyone's reactions to this is just sad. I liked what you said, Mike. People should be quick to listen and slow to speak, especially about things which they know not. Look at the plank in your own eye before you take the speck out of your brother's eye. We need to not judge people. We're all children of God.
      13 hours ago · Like · 6
    • Alfred Gawel Again, I just want to puke all over my shoes.
      13 hours ago · Like · 4
    • Mark C. Robinson Steve: I think he means that organ music doesn't 'reach' the modern culture. Personally I find it a benefit to step out of the modern and set aside Worship as a unique experience.

      I've been to 'Praise Band' worship - far too much of it. The problem 
      ...See More
      13 hours ago · Like · 2
    • Michael Tusa We go to church to join withe others to worship and adore God, not for our personal entertainment.
      13 hours ago · Like · 3
    • Daniel Baker A good time to revisit: http://ecclesiaaugustana.blogspot.com/2012/11/liturgy-is-anything-but-indiferent.html

      ecclesiaaugustana.blogspot.com
      "Haec fere summa est doctrinae apud nos, in qua cerni potest nihil inesse, quod ...See More
      13 hours ago · Edited · Like · 2
    • Jill Timm Actually, don't we go to receive Christ through Word & Sacrement?
      13 hours ago via mobile · Like · 4
    • Daniel Baker And for the record, the be-all end-all of Lutheran worship isn't praising and adoring God. It's about the forgiveness of sins and the Christian's making of eucharist, or thanksgiving, on account of the same.
      13 hours ago · Like · 1
    • Daniel Baker >>>>Actually, don't we go to receive Christ through Word & Sacrement?<<<<

      EXACTLY!
      13 hours ago · Like · 1
    • Nate Block This whole thread is completely inappropriate. There are many things being voiced in the comments of the original post and this one that are off-color considering who we are and what we are to do. The judgment, uninformed chastising and opinion of the emotion needs to stop. Share the message of Christ's love by any means necessary.
      13 hours ago · Like · 5
    • Melissa Brander Some churches do contemporary wrong. But at the same time, some churches do traditional wrong. The problem with churches, ultimately, is not a worship style, but a heart style. Some churches, of all kinds, have let their hearts lead them in the wrong d...See More
      13 hours ago · Like · 5
    • Jennifer Zander Did Jesus ever say what style we are to worship? I wish people were more open minded. This is hurtful to me.
      13 hours ago · Like · 4
    • Rebecca Quam I agree with Amalia's comment. Amalie was in ATTENDANCE of the "worship" service!
      12 hours ago · Like · 1
    • Daniel Baker "Actions speak louder than words," as they say. Jesus worshipped and preached in the traditional synagogue Service and observed the traditional Passover Rite, as did His Apostles and disciples - through long after His Ascension into Heaven. The Service of the Word is a continuation of the synagogue tradition, and the Service of the Sacrament is the fulfillment of the Passover.
      12 hours ago · Like · 1
    • Rodney Dietsche A good organ has many different stops and has a beat. Some has said, it is an orchestra a band in one instrument. Interesting that we including myself can get upset with all the stuff in the front of a church when it is guitars and drums and such. Yet we do not get upset when many organ pipes are displayed in the front. Or we have a choir stand in front to sing. one once said,
      11 hours ago · Like · 1
    • Daniel Baker I get upset when a choir stands in front to sing. Organ pipes can be stylish in the front but I honestly wouldn't prefer that either.
    • Miles Wurster “Christian musicians should let their singing and playing to the praise of the Father of all grace sound forth with joy from their organs, symphonias, virginals, regals and whatever other beloved instruments there are (recently invented and given by God), of which neither David nor Solomon, neither Persia, Greece, nor Rome, knew anything.”
      --Martin Luther (1483-1546)
      11 hours ago · Like · 4
    • Rodney Dietsche How many today are training to play an instrument to the glory of God or just to be able to play an instrument? I have hear many a pastor say we don't have an organist, nor a guitar player or piano player. Hmm why is that?
    • Daniel Baker Context? Citation? He can also be quoted as calling the ORGAN an "ensign of Baal." Hardly a rousing endorsement of contemporary forms, since it had been around for a couple centuries by that point.
    • Daniel Baker " I have hear many a pastor say we don't have an organist, nor a guitar player or piano player. Hmm why is that?" 

      Because they are under-appreciated and underpaid? I suspect we would have fewer pastors, too, if they were paid 15 dollars or nothing per Service.
      11 hours ago · Like · 2
    • Miles Wurster Couldn't tell you. But you cannot rush to condemn people/church/particular musical style just because you don't like it. Quality worship includes Biblical texts, orderly worship, focuses on God, not self, and includes congregational participation-- No...See More
      11 hours ago · Edited · Like · 3
    • Miles Wurster The Luther quote I posted, can be found in "Luther's Litergical Music" by Robin A. Leaver p. 91.
    • Daniel Baker When it comes to Lutheran worship, here's a list: "the usual public ceremonies are observed, the series of lessons, of prayers, vestments, and other like things” (Apology XXIV:1-2).
      11 hours ago · Like · 2
    • Nate Block Daniel, Luther wrote that as a recommendation and a guide, not a formal dictation.
    • John Dixon What this picture demonstrates is what Paul warned against in discerning the Lord's Body in the Communion and has become all to common. 
      This is the result of theology taking a back seat to self actualization.
    • Daniel Baker "Luther wrote that as a recommendation and a guide, not a formal dictation."

      Concerning "singing and playing" on all sorts of instruments? I would agree. Plus, I'd be curious to know if he was talking about in the context of the Divine Liturgy or elsewhere, since everything I've read indicates that he only supported instrumentation to assist congregational singing.
    • Rodney Dietsche Daniel you made me laugh out loud with your comment. "15 a service or free. A good laugh not a bad one. Then I thought, hey are we not suppose to do it to the glory of God? How much does Koine get paid? If a pastor does two service he gets his salary. If an organist does 2 service he or she gets paid for two. I have to stop commenting work to do and causing to much trouble.
      11 hours ago · Like · 1

    • Jeffery Clark Professor Wurster, having been to two of these "concert services" @ MLC, I can say that they didn't even adequately replace an evening chapel service, let alone a full service of the Word suitable for Sunday worship. Koine's music is a fine thing to be listened to on its own (in the car for example, I'm sure it is better than a lot of the trash on the radio) or even to supplement a regular worship service (even though this isn't my particular cup of tea), but to base an entire service around it and put these men (and others like them) front and center removes that particular aspect of what makes Lutheran worship special, the fact it is Christo-centric. 

      The context of the Luther statement (Ms. Leaver actually stole it almost verbatim from The pastoral Luther: essays on Martin Luther's practical theology edited by Timothy J. Wengert -- I didn't see any citations in her book, but perhaps that is the fault of Google): It is from a dedication he wrote in a hymnal. He was commenting on the fact that all instruments, the materials and the knowledge to make them, and the skill needed to play them are gifts from God and are just as good as the human voice. So yes these new instruments may be used in a worship service, but they must do so in a way so as not to remove the focus from Christ. 

      Unfortunately, the two "concert services" I attended did this very thing and turned it into an entertainment service of "me and my feelings."
      10 hours ago · Like · 3
    • Bob Winter So, according to most of you on here if you don't do the service according to your narrow-mined views then it really doesn't count. Well, newsflash the way your services are conducted doesn't fit the norm for others. You sound like a bunch of pharisees. Get over it, there is more than ONE religion and God is not nearly so narrow-minded as you seem to believe.
    • Cassie Hunt I do not and have never belonged to WELS. But, I think this conversation contains alot of confusion. When conversations like these take place many times it is what is being done is labeled bad. I would argue it is not so much what is being done is "bad...See More
    • Jeffery Clark Bob Winter, to respond to your statement, I will give you a quote from Luther:
    • Jeffery Clark Therefore, I pray all of you, my dear sirs, let each one surrender his own opinions and get together in a friendly way and come to a common decision about these external matters, so that there will be one uniform practice throughout your district inste...See More
      8 hours ago · Like · 2
    • Jeffery Clark The WELS (I won't speak for other synods, but I know LCMS does this to) purposely prints Christo-centric orders of worship in their hymnal. This is so that we have this uniform practice regarding the divine service across the whole synod. To depart fro...See More
      8 hours ago · Edited · Like · 1
    • Gregory L. Jackson This is what happens when people trust gimmicks instead of the Means of Grace. That is the litmus test, because grace comes to us only through the Word and Sacraments.http://ichabodthegloryhasdeparted.blogspot.com/2013/04/missouri-is-not-so-far-down-rathole-of.html

    • Bradley Campbell I'm astounded and apalled at some of these compliments, "Travesty, sacrilege, blasphemy, idolatry" REALLY?!?!?!?! who are u to speak for what was preached in this service? were u there? I was, with my wife Amalia Campbell. and I can assure you that there was no Idolatry in this. yes Koine was the physical center of the front of the church. Are you saying thats what matters? that pastors HAVE to preach from the Pulpit? or that the alter HAS to be set up in a certain way? if you are perhaps you should reanalyze your scripture. Matthew 18:20 says "For where two or three are come together IN MY NAME, there am I among them" there is no mention of a pulpit, a alter or HOW the service was conducted. God instructs us to come together in his name to preach his word and give him praise. Yes there was a short sermon to which some people may not have felt were "suitable for a sunday service" and it did not have some parts of the standard cookie cutter service, however God's word was preached, Jesus's story was told, and His name was praised, please tell me what is wrong with that??
      6 hours ago · Like · 2
    • Allen Michael Schmitz think vineyard church...fun with jesus
    • Gregory L. Jackson Bradley, I don't think I need to hear a five minute Easter sermon (probably copied from Groeschel) to realize this was a mockery of Easter Sunday. The purpose of worship is to preach the Gospel thoroughly, not to entertain the Boomers.
      5 hours ago · Like · 1
    • Allen Michael Schmitz think brain wash...then say Amen

    • Mark C. Robinson The greatest concern I see is when people look to the worship service to bring in new people. For my own part, I don't believe that a true worship service is the best place for a spiritual seeker. I say that because the worship service has established forms which are beneficial to those who understand them, but which cannot be appreciated fully by those who don't.

      A seeker should go to the Christian concert and get the "Jesus Saves" blended message which draws and encourages learning. When they learn enough to understand, *then* they should attend a worship service with enough knowledge to appreciate what is going on. I'm not saying they have to be confirmed: only that it's a disservice to dumb down the worship service to appeal to outsiders.
    • Christian Schulz Regarding the OP picture, it makes me wonder what, theologically, is going on and being conveyed. Does not faith and act -- doctrine and practice -- go hand-in-hand? This, to me, conveys a praise of a particular style of music rather than a reverent extolling of the sacraments while the music takes the back seat. It's pretty evident by sticking them in the front, covering the Altar from which blessings flow through the sacrament of the altar (especially on Easter, of all days to receive the risen Christ). There are major shifts happening in Lutheranism from sacramental (God coming to us to graciously forgive our sins, Sunday to Sunday, and us receiving it with reverence and awe [Hebrews 11]) to sacrificial (praise focussed - us to God - narrow sense of the word "worship") oriented services. This all, not mentioning how Lutherans confess to worship in our own Confessions of faith. What a contradiction from the start considering the Confessions.
      3 hours ago via mobile · Like
    • Allen Michael Schmitz ok are we all together on the fact that we have a cult mind/hive mind?....or im I a outsider looking in?
    • Bryan Lidtke http://ecclesiaaugustana.blogspot.com/2013/04/musings-on-contemporary-worship.html

      ecclesiaaugustana.blogspot.com
      "Haec fere summa est doctrinae apud nos, in qua cerni potest nihil inesse, quod ...See More

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bruce-church (https://bruce-church.myopenid.com/) has left a new comment on your post "Facebook Discussion about Koine Crowding Chancel E...":

Perhaps Todd Wilkens ought to mention this. A conservative LCMS church in southeast St. Louis is vacating their A-frame style chancel and building a more traditional church right on the same property:

http://www.callnewspapers.com/Articles-Our-Town-i-2013-04-03-266142.112112-Peace-to-break-ground-for-new-sanctuary.html#123

http://www.peacelutheranstl.org/expansion/