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Polluted WELS Blog Comments:
No, Mr. Meyer. You do not understand. 'Many' in scripture consistently refers to 'the many that are called'. When believers are spoken of, they are the few; the chosen.
Mr. Meyer, you are guilty of emasculating the atonement when you say Christ paid for something and then refuse the idea that His payment accomplished the cancelling of a debt. Yes, there is one justification as you say; the pardon declared for all men: IT IS FINISHED!!! which is apprehended by faith or lost by unbelief.
Mr. Meyer, you are guilty of emasculating the atonement when you say Christ paid for something and then refuse the idea that His payment accomplished the cancelling of a debt. Yes, there is one justification as you say; the pardon declared for all men: IT IS FINISHED!!! which is apprehended by faith or lost by unbelief.
Brett Meyer said...
Anonymous,
Your statements are faithful to the doctrine of Objective Justification.
They are not founded in Scripture or the Lutheran Confessions.
You state, "You do not understand. 'Many' in scripture consistently refers to 'the many that are called'. When believers are spoken of, they are the few; the chosen."
Actually I do understand. Your confession of Objective Justification - the new gospel of the ELS, WELS, ELCA and LCMS - teaches that the whole world has been forgiven all sin, the whole world's debt canceled by Christ's atonement, the whole world declared justified and righteous. Therefore you teach that the whole world has been called by stretching the meaning of the word 'many' to match the meaning of the word 'all'. Except you fail to quote Romans which teaches that those God has called He has saved eternally (glorified).
Romans 8:30, "Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Again, you clearly demonstrate why the doctrine of Objective Justification has been charged with teaching Universalism. The only way it doesn't is for the Lutheran Synods to separate salvation from the forgiveness of sins - and they have done so in the doctrine of UOJ. A wicked, convoluted and contradictory mess Objective Justification creates.
Anonymous states, "Mr. Meyer, you are guilty of emasculating the atonement when you say Christ paid for something and then refuse the idea that His payment accomplished the cancelling of a debt."
I refuse the idea...Yes, I do. Because it is only an idea and not the teaching of Scripture. Other WELS pastors have charged me with refusing to 'take the leap' much like your charge that I refuse the 'idea'. The Scripture and Confessional statements I've provided in this short discussion reject the idea and condemn the leap.
Anonymous states, "Yes, there is one justification as you say; the pardon declared for all men: IT IS FINISHED!!! which is apprehended by faith or lost by unbelief."
Lost by unbelief...? And since the unbelieving world has remained in unbelief from conception - at what glorious time were they ever declared pardoned?
Objective Justification is a false rationalistic gospel, contradictory to Scripture and the Christian Book of Concord. The Lutheran Synods are using it to lead men, women and children away from sole trust in Christ.
In Christ,
Brett Meyer
There is not one tenet of Objective Justification that does not contradict Scripture and the Lutheran Confessions.
Your statements are faithful to the doctrine of Objective Justification.
They are not founded in Scripture or the Lutheran Confessions.
You state, "You do not understand. 'Many' in scripture consistently refers to 'the many that are called'. When believers are spoken of, they are the few; the chosen."
Actually I do understand. Your confession of Objective Justification - the new gospel of the ELS, WELS, ELCA and LCMS - teaches that the whole world has been forgiven all sin, the whole world's debt canceled by Christ's atonement, the whole world declared justified and righteous. Therefore you teach that the whole world has been called by stretching the meaning of the word 'many' to match the meaning of the word 'all'. Except you fail to quote Romans which teaches that those God has called He has saved eternally (glorified).
Romans 8:30, "Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Again, you clearly demonstrate why the doctrine of Objective Justification has been charged with teaching Universalism. The only way it doesn't is for the Lutheran Synods to separate salvation from the forgiveness of sins - and they have done so in the doctrine of UOJ. A wicked, convoluted and contradictory mess Objective Justification creates.
Anonymous states, "Mr. Meyer, you are guilty of emasculating the atonement when you say Christ paid for something and then refuse the idea that His payment accomplished the cancelling of a debt."
I refuse the idea...Yes, I do. Because it is only an idea and not the teaching of Scripture. Other WELS pastors have charged me with refusing to 'take the leap' much like your charge that I refuse the 'idea'. The Scripture and Confessional statements I've provided in this short discussion reject the idea and condemn the leap.
Anonymous states, "Yes, there is one justification as you say; the pardon declared for all men: IT IS FINISHED!!! which is apprehended by faith or lost by unbelief."
Lost by unbelief...? And since the unbelieving world has remained in unbelief from conception - at what glorious time were they ever declared pardoned?
Objective Justification is a false rationalistic gospel, contradictory to Scripture and the Christian Book of Concord. The Lutheran Synods are using it to lead men, women and children away from sole trust in Christ.
In Christ,
Brett Meyer
There is not one tenet of Objective Justification that does not contradict Scripture and the Lutheran Confessions.
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| Notice how precisely Quenstedt disposes the Huber UOJ argument of righteousness without faith. Pietism took over the false Huber position, and WELS/LCMS/ELS/ELCA reflect that together. Walther's dream of unity has been accomplished! Praise the Lord and pass the popcorn - it's time for church. |
Brett Meyer said...
Anonymous the Christian Book of Concord clearly states that only on account of the gracious gift of faith in Christ alone are men accounted righteous or acceptable to God - not on account of Christ's atonement alone while the unbelieving world continues in unbelief as the false gospel of Objective Justification contends.
Also, 71] "but we maintain this, that properly and truly, by faith itself, we are for Christ's sake accounted righteous, or are acceptable to God. And because "to be justified" means that out of unjust men just men are made, or born again, it means also that they are pronounced or accounted just. For Scripture speaks in both ways. [The term "to be justified" is used in two ways: to denote, being converted or regenerated; again, being accounted righteous. Accordingly we wish first to show this, that faith alone makes of an unjust, a just man, i.e., receives remission of sins".
http://www.bookofconcord.org/defense_4_justification.php
In Christ,
Brett Meyer
Also, 71] "but we maintain this, that properly and truly, by faith itself, we are for Christ's sake accounted righteous, or are acceptable to God. And because "to be justified" means that out of unjust men just men are made, or born again, it means also that they are pronounced or accounted just. For Scripture speaks in both ways. [The term "to be justified" is used in two ways: to denote, being converted or regenerated; again, being accounted righteous. Accordingly we wish first to show this, that faith alone makes of an unjust, a just man, i.e., receives remission of sins".
http://www.bookofconcord.org/defense_4_justification.php
In Christ,
Brett Meyer
Brett Meyer said...
Also, from the Christian Book of Concord:
9] Concerning the righteousness of faith before God we believe, teach, and confess unanimously, in accordance with the comprehensive summary of our faith and confession presented above, that poor sinful man is justified before God, that is, absolved and declared free and exempt from all his sins, and from the sentence of well-deserved condemnation, and adopted into sonship and heirship of eternal life, without any merit or worth of our own, also without any preceding, present, or any subsequent works, out of pure grace, because of the sole merit, complete obedience, bitter suffering, death, and resurrection of our Lord Christ alone, whose obedience is reckoned to us for righteousness. 10] These treasures are offered us by the Holy Ghost in the promise of the holy Gospel; and faith alone is the only means by which we lay hold upon, accept, and apply, and appropriate them to ourselves.
http://www.bookofconcord.org/sd-righteousness.php
9] Concerning the righteousness of faith before God we believe, teach, and confess unanimously, in accordance with the comprehensive summary of our faith and confession presented above, that poor sinful man is justified before God, that is, absolved and declared free and exempt from all his sins, and from the sentence of well-deserved condemnation, and adopted into sonship and heirship of eternal life, without any merit or worth of our own, also without any preceding, present, or any subsequent works, out of pure grace, because of the sole merit, complete obedience, bitter suffering, death, and resurrection of our Lord Christ alone, whose obedience is reckoned to us for righteousness. 10] These treasures are offered us by the Holy Ghost in the promise of the holy Gospel; and faith alone is the only means by which we lay hold upon, accept, and apply, and appropriate them to ourselves.
http://www.bookofconcord.org/sd-righteousness.php
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| Calov was always cited as teaching UOJ, but the opposite is true. I found this in Robert Preus' essay and also in Justification and Rome. |
