---
Anonymous has left a new comment on your post "From WELS - The CORE - Mixed Message on Reaching t...":
I can see why Ski would have a bunch of picks of attractive women on his Facebook page. Let's face it. The man is sexy AND a good theologian.
---
GJ - You are pranking us, right?
---
mjleyrer has left a new comment on your post "Party in the MLS - Sharing from the Ski Wall of Fa...":
Right, because and who is making the qualifications for an idiot here? You are. Do you have any grounds to do so? No.
It's like this:
If you are a white person and you post a picture of you with a black person than you are an idiot. (Please note this is only for arguments sake, I'm not racist)
Right. Why am I an idiot? Oh, because you made up an arbitrary rule because for whatever reason you get to say what goes.
Logical fallacy? I think so. Has pastor Ski posted any sinful pictures? No. Has he violated anything biblical? No.
So maybe they're not the most morally upstanding people but if you were to take a picture with you're friend who is just as bad would Jacko get up in arms about it? I bet not.
Both of you have simply no ground to stand on.
And Jacko I think it's just plain creepy that you're Facebook stalking Ski.
And you're wrong about the Ad Hominem thing too. You can strike off the bat using ad hominem to discredit someone before they (sic) can make an argument; what Jacko is doing. [GJ - To capitalize or not to captialize, there's the rub. Why not do both and let the reader decide?]
***
GJ - Does the Wisconsin Synod have anyone who understands web publishing? The WELS.net site was a disaster and still is. The server seems to have devoured the November issue of Forward in Chicanery.
Mr. Leyrer, a product of the system, shows an abysmal ignorance of Facebook, a series of web pages. I thought the younger generation was hip on computers. Perhaps they teach oogling rather than Googling.
Reading web pages for information is called research. Facebook pages are available when people open them for a) friends, b) friends of friends, or c) everyone with an account. Facebook users are saying, with their photos, "This is what matters to me." Visitors to that den of popcorn and rock, The CORE, tell me that Ski carries on about all the celebrity photos he has posted in his office. Apparently, they are clothed poses.
I find Leyrer adopting the same Antinomian attitude which prevailed in Columbus, Ohio. It was a sin to consider clergy adultery and divorce wrong. Posing with a tart on Facebook is virtuous, edgy, and doing everything-short-of-sin to reach entertainers who extol homosexuality.
---
Anonymous has left a new comment on your post "Party in the MLS - Sharing from the Ski Wall of Fa...":
Pranking you? No way! Ski's a complete double threat - a fine looking man AND a theologian of profound depth. No wonder the ladies like him! It's like someone has spliced together the DNA of Martin Chemnitz and Brad Pitt.
Seriously.
No, seriously.
***
GJ - I agree: Martin Chemnitz' abs and Brad Pitt's theological acumen.
---
mjleyrer has left a new comment on your post "Party in the MLS - Sharing from the Ski Wall of Fa...":
Oh cute Jacko! You called me a product of the system. That is so endearing. Wait a minute... didn't you go to MLC AND the WLS? I think we have a winner! You sir, are just as much a "product" as I am.
Yeah, using the web to find information is research. Using the web to find pictures of people you want to slander is called being creepy.
Even if you consider Ski's pictures to be a sin it's a good thing you contacted him in a loving manner to take them down first before posting them to your blog and getting everyone else involved, isn't that right Jacko?
OH WAIT. YOU DIDN'T.
***
GJ - I went to accredited schools. I learned a lot about computers and the English language. Wisconsin teaches its disciples to be Antinomian deceivers, full of themselves, WELS without water, clouds without rain, tossed by every wind of doctrine.
There is an interesting root to the verb "publish." It is "public." If someone witnessed Ski waving around a girlie magazine and bragging about the topless girl from a confirmation class, he would need to go to Ski in private. However, when someone has made public his false doctrine (mindlessly channeling Groeschel) and his pride in posing with pop-tarts, Ski can be admonished in public.
I do not need to admonish - just show the evidence. The way things disappear after showing up on Ichabod is legendary. What are they ashamed of?
The Eighth Commandment Stormtroopers (day-shift UOJ Stormtroopers) never go to me privately. No, they want to publish their blubbering nonsense on a blog read around the world. That is especially true for people who only have three or four readers, all with the same last name.
"Oh, isn't our boy smart. What did he mean to say, dear? Should we leave him in Europe a few more years until he learns English? Good, I want to use his room for sewing and LWR packages. Why does it still smell like burnt rope? I hope that goes away soon."
---
mjleyrer has left a new comment on your post "Party in the MLS - Sharing from the Ski Wall of Fa...":
Wow, bravo Jacko, hit the nail on the head with that one.
The thing is though, that Facebook pictures aren't a public thing. Publishing would imply that they were meant for EVERYONE to see. Lot's (sic) of people don't have Facebook and what you have done is taken the pictures off Facebook and maliciously uploaded them onto your blog. Smells like copyright infringement to me.
"Just showing the evidence" isn't any better. If I find my neighbor sleeping with a woman other than his wife and then publish a picture of it I'm just "showing the evidence" right? Yeah, you're doing the same thing.
I'm still trying to find the false doctrine of pictures with celebrities too.
And I'm not in Europe anymore. Back in the U.S.A. it was just paining me to be so far away from you Jacko.
***
GJ - I am surprised extradition worked so fast.
Pastor Tim closed down his photo albums. Until then they were web pages "open to everyone." Please read the instructions. Nevertheless, he left his bug-eyed pose with Katy Perry on his main page. When did you sign on as his attorney? I hope you do not charge anything, because your legal advice in on par with your grammar. Violation of a copyright would include selling a protected photo for financial gain. Those photos are marked.
That old heresiarch, Stadler, tried to copyright his false doctrine, as if no one could copy it and discuss his protected words. No one tried to make money from it, although there is a lot of money in false doctrine. Just ask Perish Services.
"Maliciously"? Now you are judging motivation and thoughts, a strange and wonderful ability. Apparently your Divine Nature is not limited by your Human Nature.
If you can find a woman to explain it to you, ask what it implies when a married guy has to pose with a number of young women of scarce talent, momentary celebrity, and limited clothing. Add to that the position of pastor. There are passages about loose women in Proverbs and qualifications for a minister in the pastoral epistles. They will shed some light on your questions.
Ski and Glende want to change WELS in Fox Valley. They have done that.
---
Anonymous has left a new comment on your post "Party in the MLS - Sharing from the Ski Wall of Fa...":
Poor MJ Leyrer,
I had a hard time following his um and so because and who kind of writing. Clarity my friend.
I showed the pictures of Glende and Ski to my wife. I too have occasion to take photos with celebs. I asked her if I posted a picture of a young tart, like the pics our astute and well adjusted pastors show on their Facebook pages, if she would be offended. Yes was the answer. I asked if she thought it prudent. No was the answer. Oh, nice comment by Glende's wife by the way. Encourage and stand by your man Holly. Never mind any sort of rebuke.
I asked a young lady who is reformed and a Marine Chaplin what she thought. She thought it odd, but also figured, "Well if someone feels that the pastor is someone they can relate to, then it's o.k. It may bring someone closer to Christ." Source considered.
I asked a man in his 30's who is ELCA and son of an ELCA minister what he thought. He felt that since many congregations are growing old and shrinking in numbers - this is the reason why your are seeing the trend to gravitate toward "vapid pop-style worship" tendencies that lack any depth. He noted that he disagrees with this and notes the same of his theologically liberal father.
So gone is any objective means to measure any sort of propriety in actions and display of integrity. Gone is the Bible. Our pastors should be above reproach and not moving toward the edge and appear as though they are snugging up to a saucy tart. Gone are the days of being bound by an accountability that is higher than that of your average Joe in your congregation. Now it is anything at anytime for any reason and damned be anyone to challenge "Tyrant" in the photo.
I like how are young collegians are trying to justify these self absorbed reverends with claiming that they are not sinning. Read some Lutheran theology for once kids. All we do is sin. Nothing we do is without the stain and stench of sin to paraphrase Luther. They seem to be throwing this intentionally in the faces of the week willed circuit and district presidents, who see them "Follow the letter of the law, but not the spirit of it." I think they are just waiting to get some real and justified response from the COP. It almost seems as though they are saying, "Bring it on baby." Face it, they have their minions and would likely be able to self support if anything was done. Then being free of any sort of leadership, they could do anything they pleased then. I think this scares the life out of many leaders in WELS who have allowed this to go so far.
22 comments:
Wow, they used to have a "12 inch rule", or something like that, at MLS....
It basically said that male/female couples had to maintain a certain physical distance....technically, no hand holding, etc...
I remember a sibling that got chastised by a professor because of holding hands and being a bit too close...
Ironically, this professor had a daughter that would usually be found in the student union with her boyfriend basically trying to simultaneously swallow each other alive.
As far as I know, they were never reprimanded...
Anyway, is this Ski a single guy or what? I assume that he must be single to be posing with all this eye candy.
Also, if Ski was 18 in 1990, that would make him in his late 30's now (37 or so). If a early middle age man is still trying to get pictures with hotties a lot younger than him/out of his league (my opinion anyway), what does that say about his level of judgment?
And what does this have to do with...ANYTHING?
methinks I smell ad hominem.
Luke 12:34
For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.
....
What do we see Ski treasuring? Is it the Bible?
Dear MJLeyrer,
Technically, the claim of ad hominem would only work if Pastor Ski were trying to make a logical argument. If the opposition then attacked Pastor Ski's person or character instead of addressing the logic of his argument, you could then claim that the opposition was making an ad hominem fallacy.
Pastor Ski is not trying to make an argument here. Rather, others are making the argument that goes something like this.
IF you are a pastor AND you post pictures of yourself and known floozies, THEN you are an idiot.
Ski is a pastor.
Ski posted pictures of himself with a known floozy.
THEREFORE, Pastor Ski is an idiot.
If you would like to address the logic of that argument, please do so. Although, I think it's pretty sound.
Let's attend the CORE. I want to be just like Ski when I grow up.
Right, because and who is making the qualifications for an idiot here? You are. Do you have any grounds to do so? No.
It's like this:
If you are a white person and you post a picture of you with a black person than you are an idiot. (Please note this is only for arguments sake, I'm not racist)
Right. Why am I an idiot? Oh, because you made up an arbitrary rule because for whatever reason you get to say what goes.
Logical fallacy? I think so. Has pastor Ski posted any sinful pictures? No. Has he violated anything biblical? No.
So maybe they're not the most morally upstanding people but if you were to take a picture with you're friend who is just as bad would Jacko get up in arms about it? I bet not.
Both of you have simply no ground to stand on.
And Jacko I think it's just plain creepy that you're Facebook stalking Ski.
And you're wrong about the Ad Hominem thing too. You can strike off the bat using ad hominem to discredit someone before they can make an argument; what Jacko is doing.
Pranking you? No way! Ski's a complete double threat - a fine looking man AND a theologian of profound depth. No wonder the ladies like him! It's like someone has spliced together the DNA of Martin Chemnitz and Brad Pitt.
Seriously.
No, seriously.
Oh cute Jacko! You called me a product of the system. That is so endearing. Wait a minute... didn't you go to MLC AND the WLS? I think we have a winner! You sir, are just as much a "product" as I am.
Yeah, using the web to find information is research. Using the web to find pictures of people you want to slander is called being creepy.
Even if you consider Ski's pictures to be a sin it's a good thing you contacted him in a loving manner to take them down first before posting them to your blog and getting everyone else involved, isn't that right Jacko?
OH WAIT. YOU DIDN'T.
Wow, bravo Jacko, hit the nail on the head with that one.
The thing is though, that Facebook pictures aren't a public thing. Publishing would imply that they were meant for EVERYONE to see. Lot's of people don't have Facebook and what you have done is taken the pictures off Facebook and maliciously uploaded them onto your blog. Smells like copyright infringement to me.
"Just showing the evidence" isn't any better. If I find my neighbor sleeping with a woman other than his wife and then publish a picture of it I'm just "showing the evidence" right? Yeah, you're doing the same thing.
I'm still trying to find the false doctrine of pictures with celebrities too.
And I'm not in Europe anymore. Back in the U.S.A. it was just paining me to be so far away from you Jacko.
Correction: Hall of Shame -- not Wall of Fame
Ski's home visits are a lawsuit waiting to happen.
Jacko, don't try and argue with me when it comes to what goes and what does not go on the Internet. It's my area of concentration.
Read the Digital Millennium Copyright Act and you will find that what you're doing is in clear violation.
And you really need to get off the whole 'Youhavebadgrammar' thing. No one cares.
For a Shrinker who tries hard to look hip and cool, Pastor Ski sure looks terribly starstruck in those photos.
Ski and Glende need to leave Fox Valley. They are useless to WELS unless you count the humor of their blatant false teachings and outside of fellowship wanderings.(Mars Hill, Drive, etc)
You should here my pastor preach against the outside-the-frame- work of fellowship. Ski and Glende would turn red and start running toward the exit. Music is part of the worship service, and only WELS/ELS members are permitted to perform. That's the rule at my church and other "real" WELS churches.
In response to mjleyer{Matthias?), Pastor GJ was required to attend some classes at WLS. He met some very gospel centered people when he came into the WELS. Later-on he would encounter some rather self-centered pastors and leaders.
In Christ,
from WELS church lady
For you lonely hearts out there, stop pining away. Ski and Glende make home visits.
We'd all agree that Facebook, YouTube and other sites like them have changed the way we think of what's private and what's public.
It's so easy for people to want to share with the world everything that they find "funny" or "neat." I'm not a cyber-stalker, but I have searched for the Facebook pages of people I know. While many are locked to the general public, a number of them allow anyone to search their pages.
Photos in a photo album at home are private. Photos on my office wall are not. Photos on a server somewhere are not--in my estimation--private. Great care ought to be taken.
The qualifications of a pastor as written in 1 Timothy 3 are ones that all pastors must remember soberly. As Prof. Armin Schuetze wrote in his "People's Bible" commentary, "Before God no one is above reproach. If this calls for sinlessness and perfection, who could qualify? Paul has in mind, 'consistent, mature Christian living which gives no occasion for public reproach' (Kent). Paul seems to refer here to reproach on the part of fellow Christians ..."
In my nearly twenty years of ministry there have been times that I've had to call a parishoner and apologize for poor judgment on my part.
On Friday afternoon I visited a widow in our congregation who told me how much she liked that I am "down to earth." I appreciate hearing that. I want the people I serve to feel comfortable speaking with me.
Yet, I must also be careful that I don't simply become their buddy. I get silly with the people I serve, but I've learned the limits of it.
(to be continued)
(continued)
I visited with Ski in March of this year. A room off his office at the CORE is filled with pictures of him with various celebrities and sports figures. He's proud that through a friend he has access to celebrities.
Fast forward about seven months. It's the end of October. I'm in my office late on a Friday afternoon. Five minutes from leaving I receive a phone call from a gentleman who tells me that he's experiencing a spiritual crisis. He asks if he can come visit. I told him I'd wait for him.
The gentleman and I spoke for about an hour. Near the end of our conversation I discovered that this young man visits with many pastors--from all denomiations--throughout the Fox Valley. He actually is quite knowledgable about Scripture and knows the differences of the various denominations of Christianity.
The gentleman asks me about the WELS and tells me that he's not real sure about WELS pastors since he met one in Appleton a few weeks earlier. I asked him if he would share with me the name of the WELS pastor he met in Appleton. His reply, "He goes by the name of 'Ski.'"
I then asked the gentleman what upset him about Ski. He says, "Well, he has this room filled with pictures of himself and famous people. He went on and on about them and how he knew them. You know, I just think a pastor would want to tell me about Jesus."
So, not every "lost" young man gravitates toward pop culture when he's looking for serious answers to spiritual troubles.
For months I've wanted to be fair about Ski. I still do. Realize this, though. The "celebrity" ministry Ski seems to prefer does detract from the Savior.
Trying to be fair about Ski's photos published on Ichabod, I called three women (ranging in age from mid-40's to mid-60's)from my congregation into my office an hour ago. I asked them, "If this man is your pastor, what are your impressions of these photos?"
"Is he married?" they ask. "Yes," I tell them.
I go on. "Would you want me to post these on my Facebook page or hang them in my office?"
The ladies told me that they would "question it" and "be concerned." One said she would find it "awkward" to have her pastor standing next to a scantily clad celebrity.
Whether or not GJ ought to post these pictures on Ichabod isn't the real issue here. If he can find them in cyberspace, anyone with some knowledge of computers can do so, also.
Ski's unique personality *can* be used for ministry. However, he needs to learn the limits.
""Oh, isn't our boy smart. What did he mean to say, dear? Should we leave him in Europe a few more years until he learns English? Good, I want to use his room for sewing and LWR packages. Why does it still smell like burnt rope? I hope that goes away soon.""
Actually, he belongs in our military service and do some growing up.
CG pastors are hip with hiphop stars and pop stars, and I'm sure that causes them to lose more members than they gain. Also, what type of church persons would that gain, anyway?! It reminds me of a joke along the lines of the auto industry joke. First the auto industry joke:
How do you make a small fortune in the auto industry? Answer: Start with a big fortune.
How do you turn a church into a missionizing church? Answer: Start with a large church, get a CG pastor(s), and before you know it it's shrunk down to where it's considered a mission in need of synodical mission subsidies, and that church must start missionizing or merging with another church just to stay afloat.
Church Lady,
Only WELS/ELS members are permitted to perform at St. Peter's too as far as I know. I know of a member there who doesn't like or "get" the rule so I am pretty sure it is still in effect.
You would have to ask Pastor Ski on the procedure over at The CORE.
Be careful in your assumptions because not all of what you hear is the truth.
"Jacko, don't try and argue with me"
WHAT? this guy is a college graduate and he writes "don't try and..."
Hey, leyrer, we'll get together sometime. Lemme buy ya a proposition down at the "learn how to write cafe"
Or should it be "learn how and write cafe"
Poor MJ Leyrer,
I had a hard time following is um and so because and who kind of writing. Clarity my friend.
I showed the pictures of Glende and Ski to my wife. I too have occasion to take photos with celebs. I asked her if I posted a picture of a young tart, like the pics our astute and well adjusted pastors show on their Facebook pages, if she would be offended. Yes was the answer. I asked if she thought it prudent. No was the answer. Oh, nice comment by Glende's wife bye the way. Encourage and stand by your man Holly. Nevermind any sort of rebuke.
I asked a young lady who is reformed and a Marine Chaplin what she thought. She thought it odd, but also figured, "Well if someone feels that the pastor is someone they can relate to, then it's o.k. It may bring someone closer to Christ." Source considered.
I asked a man in his 30's who is ELCA and son of an ELCA minister what he thought. He felt that since many congregations are growing old and shrinking in numbers - this is the reason why your are seeing the trend to gravitate toward "vapid pop-style worship" tendencies that lack any depth. He noted that he disagrees with this and notes the same of his theologically liberal father.
So gone is any objective means to measure any sort of propriety in actions and display of integrity. Gone is the Bible. Our pastors should be above reproach and not moving toward the edge and appear as though they are snugging up to a saucy tart. Gone are the days of being bound by an accountability that is higher than that of your average Joe in your congregation. Now it is anything at anytime for any reason and damned be anyone to challenge "Tyrant" in the photo.
I like how are young collegians are trying to justify these self absorbed reverends with claiming that they are not sinning. Read some Lutheran theology for once kids. All we do is sin. Nothing we do is without the stain and stench of sin to paraphrase Luther. They seem to be throwing this intentionally in the faces of the week willed circiut and district predsidents, who see them "Follow the letter of the law, but not the spirit of it." I think they are just waiting to get some real and justified response from the COP. It almost seems as though they are saying, "Bring it on baby." Face it, they have their minions and would likely be able to self support if anythig was done. Then being free of any sort of leadership, they could do anything they pleased then. I think this scares the life out of many leaders in WELS who have allowed this to go so far.
Post a Comment