Another Doctrinal Pussycat Lawyers Up

Joe Krohn:

WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 14, 2011

Fair Thee WELS 911 If you have been following along, the correspondences in this post need little explanation.

The longer I live I tend to believe less and less that there are coincidences in this world. I do believe and appreciate irony more and more. The Bible is chocked full of it. The final word came down from the DP on...wait for it...9-11.

Our response to DP Glaeske on September 9, 2011:

"Pastor,

I see where this is going and it is deplorable. It is not truly meet, right and salutary for you, Holy Word and WELS since you are acting in their interest to treat us in this fashion. You are culpable since you will not address the issue.

We were never allowed discussion regarding the chief article of faith, namely Justification. We felt Pastor Patterson was in error by preaching that all are forgiven prior to birth; prior to Baptism; prior to hearing the Word of God. During one meeting I asked how this applied to Abraham. I was told that it was the wrong question to ask. You excommunicate us (This is really what it is since we were told to repent of our sin and denied Holy Communion; sin being a breaking of God’s Law of which we were never told which commandment.); and then discuss the issue, your side only, with the whole congregation; you run us down behind our backs and then you have the gall to excuse your dishonest behavior by saying we are not in fellowship if we joined another church when in fact it was YOU that broke fellowship; excommunicated us in the first place! You are criticizing us for the logical consequence of YOUR actions when we were quite willing to talk and repeatedly asked to talk about Justification; not just with the pastors but also with the elders.

We watched the internet stream of the recent WELS 2011 Convention. Pastor Glaeske, you were the only leader who stood up and really opposed the NNIV. (Ironically, the NNIV creates more ambiguity regarding justification by faith.) I praised God and said ‘good on him’. If you are unwilling to address this issue and blame us in the process, then you are condoning the preaching of Objective Justification as Holy Word is teaching it and I would say then that WELS has gone too far, ‘pitching their tent toward Sodom’.

We were extended the right hand of fellowship and have received Holy Communion at a church that is not in fellowship with the WELS. We longed for the means of Grace in Word and Sacrament. What choice did we have? This has been dragging on since before the 21st of May! I have answered your question. Now I have one for you that I would like an answer. Do you believe that all men were forgiven of their sins before they were born; before receiving Baptism or hearing the Word of God? There are Lutheran pastors including some in the WELS that refute this teaching.

Please afford us an answer.

In Christ, Joe and Lisa Krohn"

Pastor Glaeske on September 11, 2011:

"Dear Joe and Lisa,

I wish you both well. The appeal process is an internal procedure for WELS members to redress grievances and would have been available to you had you not chosen to align yourselves with a church not in our fellowship. Consequently I choose not to answer the question you pose at the end of your e-mail.

God grant you peace and joy in serving your Savior in your new church home.

In His service,

Vilas R. Glaeske, President South Central District - WELS"

From where I sit, there is no need for me to make a distress call...on the other hand...there are those who can.

From my Catechism; the one I have been quoting from the last two posts:

371.Why is the ministry of the Keys called the peculiar authority of the Church?

The Church and only the Church has the authority to use the Keys.

372.How is the Church to use the Keys?

The Church is to proclaim the Gospel of full forgiveness of sins and declare the kingdom of heaven opened. (Where there is forgiveness of sins there is also life and salvation.) 2 Cor. 5:19, Luke 24:47, Rom. 8:1, Rom. 4:8)

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rlschultz has left a new comment on your post "Another Doctrinal Pussycat Lawyers Up":

I guess that some folks refuse to answer questions which make them feel uncomfortable. What a waste of a potentially good breakfast. There are several individuals who have have egg all over their faces.

Polity Issues Useful for Dodging the Real Problems

narrow-minded has left a new comment on your post "Join Me in the CFW Walther Sainthood Project":

The LCMS Walther venerators are a hoot. Some act as if Christ is not present in Word and Sacrament if received in a parish not utilizing congregational polity. Yet, they pass Resolution 8-08A in 2010, making the LCMS hierarchical. How many LCMS clergy/laity have left for the "utopia" of Rome/Constantinople?

Is episcopal polity perfect? Certainly not, as we have seen from many church bodies; but polity is adiaphorous. Our sin can screw up any form of church governance.

Instead of falling prostrate at the mention of Walther's name, and spitting at the mention of Loehe/Grabau, perhaps Missouri should study Scripture (after getting a decent translation) and the BOC.

None of these guys were perfect, and even the pietist Walther would be condemning the LCMS for what they are doing today. He chewed them out for the suggestion of singing Methodist hymns. Of course, even TLH contains a vast repertoire of Wesley and Watts hymns.

***

GJ - 

There is such a gap between the historical and mythical Walther that anyone can justly accuse the LCMS and its Concordia Hysterical Institute of fraud, deceit, and perjury. Walther was a scheming, lying demon who followed a known multiple-adulterer to America and suddenly discovered, to his own advantage, that this same Bishop Stephan was fooling around with several women. Schocking!

Honest clergy would admit that the real issues in the Scriptures are the efficacy of the Word, the Means of Grace, and justification by faith. The vast majority bicker congregational versus episcopal government when all the Lutheran sects are papal - teaching the sect's indefectibility, the Bible's lack of clarity and efficacy, the Synod Pope's infallibility, the necessity of works, and the glories of <s>Mary</s> Walther.

Intrepids, Iver Johnson, Christian Worship

Stand back. This Spanx body stocking is going to explode!

The latest Intrepid post by Lindee cited the ruminations of Iver Johnson, one of the main editors of the Booze and Broads Edition of Christian Worship. Iver was carrying on an affair with the church secretary for 10 years when he was finally caught. He promptly divorced his wife of 50 years and married the secretary. His lovely second wife came to his funeral, but his ex-wife did not.

Iver Johnson, Richard Stadler, and Michael Albrecht served as the pastors of a former WELS congregation. Stadler and his new wife would sit in the same pew with Stadler's first wife and her new husband. Iver also sat there with his new bride. These WELS pastors were playing Open Marriage while Stadler was featured as the main speaker at WELS youth conferences, including the one in Columbus, Ohio. Of course, it is difficult to object to the pastoral Open Marriage game when the Daddy Warbucks are doing the same thing. And how can the synodical leaders object to Daddy Warbucks Open Marriage when their favorite pastors leaders are doing the same thing?

Eastcoast says:
WELS “claims” that “synod (and district) is church,” they practice just the opposite. When is comes to maintaining doctrine and practice both synod and district leaders, from Synod President on down, proclaim over and over again that “there’s nothing we can do about ______________(fill in the blank).” On the other hand, LCMS officials, CPs, DPs, and SPs, toss guys out whenever they feel like it and threaten congregations like Otten’s all the time. So much for the supposed difference between Missouri and Wisconsin on Church & Ministry. It always was a bogus issue!

Ichabod Given Advanced Status at University

The University of Phoenix selected me for a program where only a few faculty were allowed to participate. Academic supervisors had to nominate faculty for the program. Each professor had to complete an intensive four-week program to qualify for the status. I finished the program and was given the title Certified Advanced Facilitator.

I will be allowed to participate in a forum limited to those who have also completed the  same requirements. Fortunately, there were no dangerous initiation rites required...or even expected.

WELS Secret Initiation Rite - GA - Still Active at The Sausage Factory:Six Just Finished

Dateline: Mequon.

The secret, abusive initiation rite called GA has just finished.

WELS synod-minders deny that GA is still being carried out. Silly, stupid, and dangerous sorority tricks are losing ground, due to successful lawsuits and unsuccessful trips to ICU.

Baby Blue Eyes, I hate to tell you, but GA just finished at Mequon, with six hand-picked newbies going through it.

Doubtless the original goal of abusing all the freshmen was trimmed, because some people just cannot keep a secret. Also, a smaller size allowed first-year students to claim, "I was there and I saw no GA initiation. I did not take off all my clothes outside, swim in raw sewage, or do all those other cool things to help me fit in."

And they would be telling the truth, as far as that went. All the students know the truth. News travels faster at WLS than it does at Ft. Leavenworth, the future home for some of their more distinguished graduates.