What Proves UOJ Is False? - They Live in the Law, Condemned by Their Own Law, and Bear No Fruit

This Torquemada is ever alert to condemn faith,
to ignore the Means of Grace,
to blaspheme the Biblical doctrine of the Holy Spirit
exclusively at work in the Word of God.
His autobiography condemns him as clueless
about the Christian Faith.

Author Archive -- Jim Pierce
Jim Pierce is a layman from Seattle, Washington. He is a blogger and author. He is a graduate of the University of Washington and has a career in systems administration. By the mercy and grace of God, his journey has taken him away from Pentecostalism into eighteen years of atheism, and he is now at peace as a Confessional Lutheran where he attends Messiah Lutheran Church in Seattle with his dear wife Suzanne and their two children.

1. 

   Brett Meyer
   February 27th, 2014 at 17:24 | #23

   Reply | Quote

   Joe Krohn :
   Brett, you are blind! In your Luther quote is embedded exactly what you are arguing against!
   “He who believes that Christ came to redeem us, and that he has accomplished it, is really redeemed.”

   And yet I can see the sentence that preceeded your quote which states,“74. But what is the process whereby Christ gives us such a spirit and redeems us from under the Law? The work is effected solely by faith.”
   The accomplishment of redeeming the individual is through faith and not before and without as you contend.
   for He has redeemed, justified, and saved us from our sins as God and man, through His complete obedience; that therefore the righteousness of faith is the forgiveness of sins, reconciliation with God, and our adoption as God’s children only on account of the obedience of Christ, which through faith alone, out of pure grace, is imputed for righteousness to all true believers, and on account of it they are absolved from all their unrighteousness.”
   http://bookofconcord.org/sd-righteousness.php

   Joe Krohn :
   Christ had to redeem us in order for us to believe we are redeemed. That is what Luther is saying! And if you are saying (which seems to be the case) that not all men are/were redeemed, them you are guilty of limited redemption because the ‘paying of the world’s iniquity’ effects something for all men.

   Prove from Scripture your UOJ teaching that Christ had to redeem us in order for us to believe we are redeemed.

   Prove from Scripture your UOJ teaching that (Christ’s) paying of the world’s iniquity effects something for all men. In the sense that you intend it – i.e. that the whole world of unbelievers were forgiven by God because of the atonement of Christ. The effect of the atonement was that all righteousness is in and of Christ. Those that are in Christ through faith have all that is His. Those who abide in unbelief have nothing of His and therefore remain under God’s wrath and condemnation.

   Your rationalistic UOJ assumptions are rejected by the clear teaching of Scripture and the faithful explanation of the BOC.

   Jim Pierce :
   I mean, just look at the language… “as one trespass led to condemnation for all men, so one act of righteousness leads to justification and life for all men.”… Yet, here, Brett (and others in this thread) reject the Scriptural language “leads to justification and life for all men.” That is they reject that what Christ did (as opposed to what Adam did) “leads to justification… for all men.”

   Mr. Pierce, I’m glad you posted this Scriptural quote. The problem with this defense of UOJ’s teaching that all men are justified is that this verse states that all those justified are also saved eternally – “…and life for all men.” So you either have to back away from using this as a Objective Justification verse and, in classic UOJ style, teach it now is a Subjective Justification verse (just as it was once forbidden to eat meat on Friday’s yet it is now approved) or you must claim Universalism where all those thereby justified are also saved eternally. This is another clear example of UOJ’s eternal contradiction to Scripture.