dk has left a new comment on your post "DK's Big Van Available for Confessional Raid on Ch...":
Well,
IJ Reilly, I'm not sure if you're Confessional or a C&Cer so take this how you want:
It's better to do something about a problem than to sit around and gripe. I'm not saying anything about you or readers of this site, but there are A LOT of Confessional WELSians that just gripe. That's part of the reason the WELS is where it is; because the people who actually saw the problems just complained and stuck their heads in the sand of "it'll never happen to us".
What've you done Reilly? I've informed at least 15 people (five pastors)about UOJ, most of whom have done the applicable homework (easier thanks to Dr. Jackson) and come away with the belief that UOJ actually does challenge the efficacy of the Word. Beyond that, I've been writing to old friends who were led astray (towards Enthusiasm) with me back at WLC. I'm engaging people in conversation about the problems in the WELS and LCMS, asking hard questions of people who've been given authority.
I'm not "oh so proud" of anything I've done in this regard. It's small potatoes. But at least I go beyond complaining. And if I want to go pass out fliers to C&Cers at their little convention (and maybe paint my van) more power to me.
Chronic gripers are marginalized and petty.
Dr. Jackson's Lincoln is truly the Uber-Swank and house paint would sully it. Must be my van.
---
dk has left a new comment on your post "Responsive Reading for Church and Chicanery Openin...":
Howdy Professor!
If you could write me a one paragraph statement about how Church and Change wants to destroy the Efficacy of the Word I would appreciate it.
I'm going to go down to the C&C conference and pass out fliers. I'd really like to engage some of these folks in conversation and give them a flier with a concise summary on it.
I'd really love to have a group of Confessional WELS folks to join me. I can fit about ten people in my van. Maybe if we don't make a spectacle (will a painted van) people will be more likely to join me.
Email me if you're interested in joining me. My goal is win over our fellow Christians and to fight the Enthusiasm that's infecting the WELS.
email Dave at
folkright@gmail.com
***
GJ - Here is my paragraph. Copy and paste as you see fit:
Church and Change began--and still exists--to promote the false doctrine and unionism of Fuller Seminary and its offspring in WELS. This group hired Baptist Ed Stetzer to teach WELS members and pastors the Word of God - only the intervention of the District Presidents stopped them. Earlier they hired Leonard Sweet! This organization trusts human methods rather than the efficacy of the Word. They are eager to replace Biblical worship with rock entertainment, as if people could be sneaked into the Kingdom of God rather than converted by the Gospel Promises. They believe coaching, a current business fad, will make the church grow. They despise the Means of Grace, as proven by their loathing of the liturgy and Creeds, their refusal to serve Holy Communion at Sunday services, and their blatant copying of the sermons of false teachers: Mark Driscoll, Craig Groeschel, Bill Hybels. The leaders of this group have knelt at the feet of false teachers at Fuller Seminary, Denver, and Gordon Conwell to earn their DMins in Church Growth. They worship with false teachers such as Andy Stanley, Ed Stetzer, and Mark Driscoll.
KJV 2 Timothy 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
KJV Isaiah 55:8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. 9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts. 10 For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater: 11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.
"Wohl scheint auf den ersten Blick die ganze Differenz recht unbedeutend; aber in Wahrheit gibt sich hier die gefaehrliche Richtung der Pietisten zu erkennen, das Leben ueber die Lehre, die Heiligung ueber die Rechtfertigung und die Froemmigkeit nicht als Folge, sondern als Bedingung der Erleuchtung zu setzen also eine Art Synergismus und Pelagianismus einzufuehren. (At first glance, the total difference seems absolutely paltry, but in truth the dangerous direction of Pietism is made apparent: life over doctrine, sanctification over justification, and piety not as a consequence but declared as a stipulation of enlightenment, leading to a kind of synergism and Pelagianism.)" Adolf Hoenecke, Evangelische-Lutherische Dogmatik, 4 vols., ed., Walter and Otto Hoenecke, Milwaukee: Northwestern Publishing House, 1912, III, p. 253.
27 comments:
Hi, I am currently looking for a congregation with whom to worship and serve. I was born into the WELS but fell away at an early age and was not very responsible with my Faith. Can you suggest a Church in the Green Bay area and also what to be aware of as I look?
DK --
No, I haven't done any of those things that you have done and about which you have bragged with all humility. The truth is that I haven't done those things because... (wait for it)... I don't think those things are such big deals! Everything that I have read about UOJ on this website fails to convince me that there is a warm bucket of spit's worth of a difference between teaching UOJ and what Greg teaches. Please, explain to me what the difference is between UOJ and saying that Jesus' death paid for all the sins of everyone who's ever lived. As far as CG is concerned, EVERY pastor is engaged in church growth. Even Greg doesn't confine his preaching to an empty room (although that's where it takes place, apparently). He broadcasts it for as many to see as possible. Why does he do this? I think he does this, at least in part, to reach people who haven't heard the gospel yet. Every church makes decisions, builds buildings, schedules services, etc. to make it possible for those inside and outside the church to hear the message. I'm not involved in C&C, but I do personally know some of the pastors who are and I know (though personal contact) that these are men who do not water down God's Word (as many in the CG movement do). In my experience, most of the oppostion to their methods comes from people who simply don't like the idea of a certain style of music being in a worship service. I say, "Hey why don't we let 20th and 21st Century Christians add their words and their voices to the worship of the Lord that has been taking place for 2000 years?" Just my two cents.
I hear that St. Mark is the place to be.
crane - I rejoice that you are being called back into the fold. Welcome also to Ichabod.
We have marked and encourage you to *avoid* St. Mark's in Green Bay/De Pere. It is a WINO (WELS In Name Only) church that is fellowship with Willow Creek Assoc of goofy worship & apostasy.
It pains me that I can't just say, "Show up at any WELS church and refresh in God's Word." The WELS Locator (http://wels.locatorsearch.com/) lists a few others in Green Bay that hopefully still preach the Word, worship in liturgical manner, and adhere to the confessions, and properly discern Law & Gospel.
I would rank the Green Bay WELS churches as follows:
1) First Lutheran
2) St. Paul
3) Messiah
<< large gap >>
4) Beautiful Savior
5) St. Mark
There also is an ELS church I've heard of, but I can't remember the name of it.
As for what to look for, I think it's always the same thing: do they preach the Gospel and faithfully administer the Sacraments? If the answer is yes, then you can start to nitpick on the other things.
The think about First Lutheran is that it's a dead church. Give it a few more years and the congregation won't exist.
Hey Fox,
Do you have personal experience at St. Mark. Is this the one in DePere or Green Bay?
If you're willing to drive to Appleton, St. Paul and Riverview are also very good and have excellent confessional pastors.
+Diet O. Worms - what is Willow Creek Assoc of goofy worship & apostasy? Is this real or just a nick name? Looks like I have a lot of studying to do.
Hey Crane:
Welcome back!
I've had luck with this site for locating Confessional Churches:
http://www.lutheranliturgy.org/
I typed in a Green Bay address and the closest one listed on the site is Menasha which is 28 miles away. That's not saying that's the only Confessional Church in the area, but it might serve to call Pastor Billings at 920-722-2662 and ask him if he knows of anyone closer.
Responding to Reilly: I don't think you're using discernment to delineate between two incongruous things; or perhaps you don't understand. 'Church Growth' in common parlance, is strategy to increase the number of Christians, using something other than Word and Sacrament. Orthodox Christians know this strategy is a siren song of Satan. Church and Change is an organization who loves this siren song; swallowing the lie that because "we're WELS we can use methods created by the heretics... we'll just change the message".
Textbook example of Lucifer's tricks.
Another trick of the enemy is manipulating language. For example, fallaciously comparing pastors who publish worship service times to pastors who sucker people into the couch/pews with popcorn and Caramel double whip Lattes.
Regarding UOJ: I think I can offer something better than warm spit. The following quote is from W.A. Maier's paper on Justification
<<<<<<<"The work Christ accomplished for all persons in all ages of human history, objectively (that is, whether or not individuals among mankind ever come to know, believe, and benefit from it in terms of personally obtained salvation) is also referred to in the New Testament by words of the hilaskesthai-family, hilasmos, hilaskesthai, and hilasteerion. The verb hilaskesthai may mean (1) to expiate or (2) to propitiate, appease, placate. Similarly the noun hilasmos may mean (1) expiation, means of appeasing, or (2) propitiation, means of propitiating. Some commentators loosely regard “to expiate” and “to propitiate” as synonymous, as they do “expiation” and “propitiation.” But there is a distinction in the two renderings of the verb and in the two renderings of the noun, which the English dictionary makes clear (as well as these words’ usage in the New Testament). To expiate means to endure the due and full penalty for a wrong, to atone for, make amends, or
reparation for, and this usually with a view to pacifying the individual or deity against whom injury has been done; expiation signifies the means by which the satisfaction is accomplished, the atonement is rendered. To propitiate means, on the basis of amends made, actually to appease and placate the anger of an injured party, whether man or God, and cause his wrath to cease; propitiation signifies the means by which the actual pacification is accomplished. To expiate (expiation) focuses attention upon the penalty paid and this as fully commensurate with the wrong perpetrated; upon the potentiality of the placation of wrath on the part of the one who has been injured. To propitiate (propitiation) points particularly to the purpose of the work of reparation, the placation of wrath, and to the accomplishment of this objective, the actual appeasement of anger in the case of the injured party. The immediate context and wider context of the New Testament (the analogy of faith) indicate which of the meanings for hilaskesthai and hilasmos are to be adopted at a given location.
There are two occurrences of the verb and two of the noun in the New Testament, as follows:>>>>>>>
It was difficult to choose one quote because the paper is complete item. It's available on the wls essayfiles.
Mr crane:
I don't live in the area, but have, on occasion, had the great pleasure of worshiping at St. Paul's, in downtown Appleton (WELS). You will hear from her pulpit the all-important messages of Scripture -- that of the Law and of the Gospel -- rightly divided and applied. You will find outgoing Christians, eager to bear with you in your burdens and share with you their Gospel Joy. You will sit under orthodox teaching. In addition, you will have the timeless truths of the Bible and the Lutheran Confessions reinforced, not through the disruptions of temporary fad and fashion, but in time-honored liturgical practice, as by it you are reverently focused on Christ, and the Means through which His Holy Spirit works, for the duration of the Divine Service, and as you are thoughtfully carried by it through a cycle of receiving and offering -- of His blessed gifts through Word and Sacrament, and of your sacrificial responses of thanks, praise, and adoration. Indeed, in this practice you will also find the four distinctive characteristics of the Lutheran Church maintained in balance: we are evangelical and we are orthodox -- but so is everybody these days (or so they claim); but only Lutherans are also catholic and apostolic.
Though I know they must be there, I have not witnessed the faults of St. Paul's, in Appleton. I give this congregation high marks.
I would contact one of their pastors. I have personal acquaintance with Rev. Frey. For your conscience's sake, you may want to consider private confession with a pastor, and to personally receive absolution from him. You'll also likely benefit from re-instruction, given that you've been away for awhile.
Lord's Blessings,
Freddy Finkelstein
I.J., UOJ states that Christ died and paid for the sins of the whole world.
BOC states that Christ died and paid for the sins of the whole world.
UOJ states that because Christ paid for the sins of the whole world, the whole world has had the burden of sin removed and God has delcared, by divine verdict, that the whole unbelieving world stands justified, forgiven of all sin, guiltless and righteous.
BOC states that even though Christ paid for the sins of the whole world the righteousness that removes sin is in Christ and never apart from Him. Christ is only our propitiation, mediator, by faith alone.
This is the issue that Michael Schottey didn't answer in an earlier post. For the world to be declared forgiven and justified they must have Christ's righteousness. Scripture teaches that the only way to have Christ's righteousness is for Christ to be in us and we in Him through faith. Only by faith do we obtain Christ as mediator. UOJ has Christ being a part of the whole unbelieving world - merging the unrepentant, carnaly minded, dead in sins with the righteousness, sinlessness and glory of God. Unbelievers are alive to sin and because of that remain under the wrath of God. Christ says we must die to sin and be raised again by faith to life, through the work of the Holy Spirit in the means of grace, Word and Baptism.
BOC confesses that God justifies, forgives a person of his sin, instantaneously when the Holy Spirit works faith in the person to believe that Christ died and paid for his sins. BOC teaches that faith makes of an unjust man a just man. Note this statement. Before faith the BOC declares the man unjust (not justified).
UOJ confesses that justification is a process. God declares the unbeliever forgiven and justified. But they aren't forgiven and justified until the Holy Ghost works faith in them to believe that they've already been declared forgiven and justified by God. UOJ teaches that the faith with which a man makes God's declaration of justification his own doesn't do anything but is an empty and open hand receiving what was already declared by God to be true.
UOJ is a heinous false doctrine that destroys true Scriptural doctrine of justification by faith alone. It replaces Christ's Gospel and and removes a person from Christ and His Church.
Excellent way of putting it Brett
Brett: Well said.
Crane:
"Willow Creek" is an association of churches that specialize in goofy worship, errancy, "Enthusiasm," "Sacramentarianism," discordance, works-righteousness, Christian-centered but not Christ-centered sermons, and apostasy. (In a nutshell, decidedly un-Lutheran.)
For some reason, despite all of the church fathers' warnings that dabbling with the apostates is like playing with tar pitch, St. Mark (De Pere & Green Bay) is still listed with that group as a member church.
At the top left of Ichabod's main page, if you search for "Willow Creek" and scan the articles, you'll get a quick look at the errors in teaching.
Mr. Crane, I gladly offer you a new KJV Bible and Book of Concord if you lack either. With these you can test the spirits to see if they are of God. With these you can by the grace of God discern between pure doctrine and practice that which is false. With these you can stand fast in the doctrine of Christ and endure as a child of God, justified by faith alone, for eternity. With these you will garner the wrath and hatred of those who are on the wide path so that burdened by the cross, Christ will build you up in the one true faith unto life everlasting.
It is a sincere offer with which you will be able to test whatever you hear and read where ever you go.
My email is brettdotmeyeratcomcastdotnet
A searchable web version of the KJV Bible can also be found here
http://www.htmlbible.com/kjv30/index.htm
A web version of the Book of Concord can be found here
http://www.bookofconcord.org/
In light of everything that you say against Universal Objective Justification, I see nothing in scripture that says the contrary. In fact, I find much that affirms it.
Romans 5:18 - Consequently, just as the result of one trespass was condemnation for all men, so also the result of one act of righteousness was justification that brings life for all men. For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.
I would say that this makes justification universal, meaning that it applies to all men because Christ paid the sacrifice for sins. Justification is objective because it is a fact that has nothing to do with us, but everything to do with God.
But we cannot have UOJ without Subjective Justification, saying that we only benefit from this justification by faith. Therefore, we do not believe that those still within the depravity of their sin stand in righteousness. That comes through Christ, but that the world has been declared not guilty, who can argue? This doesn't mean that they are not responsible for their sin, for they are, it is not until the Holy Spirit comes and works faith that any sort of reconciliation apart from wrath can be made with the Lord.
The C&C conference is a long way from the SCD. I'm worried about you DK. I cannot be there to protect you from hot lattes, popcorn balls, and money changers. "I Will Trust And Not Be Afraid". Just a memory treasure for you DK!
If the worst happens you get one phone call and we all have GJ's not so secret number. I am praying for you DK.
In Christ
from WELS church lady
Does faith create the forgiveness of sins? Did God eternally elect someone to be saved simply because God in His foreknowledge saw that the person would be a Christian?
Fox Mulder, this website is repleat with Scriptural and Confessional refutation of your false statements.
Note that your quote of Romans if taken alone without the rest of Scripture actually states that all men are saved. Romans 5:18, "Consequently, just as the result of one trespass was condemnation for all men, so also the result of one act of righteousness was justification that brings life for all men."
If you declare that this verse means that all men, the whole unbelieving world, are justified (result of one act of righteousness was justification ....for all men) then you also must declare that they are also saved for the verse also states that the ..."justification that brings life ..." applies to "...all men." Your isolated view of this passage is that of Tholuck. You expose yourself and Objective Justification as a Universalist religion and not Christian. "Life" in this verse is not a synonym for "forgiveness" it is a synonym for "salvation", "eternal salvation."
But again you also fail to confess the truth of Scripture in your assertion because you've made Christ a propitiation for the whole unbelieving world (forgiving them their sins while they are alive to sin, carnaly minded and rotting in the decay and stench of complete separation from God) while they are outside of faith.
Scripture declares that Christ is the propitiation for our sins only through faith. We have access to the righteousness of Christ only through faith.
Romans 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
1 John 4:10 Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins.
BOC - The Defense of the Augsburg Confession What Is Justifying Faith?, 48] "The adversaries feign that faith is only a knowledge of the history, and therefore teach that it can coexist with mortal sin. Hence they say nothing concerning faith, by which Paul so frequently says that men are justified, because those who are accounted righteous before God do not live in mortal sin."
http://www.bookofconcord.org/defense_4_justification.php
BOC - "The wrath of God cannot be appeased if we set against it our own works, because Christ has been set forth as a Propitiator, so that, for His sake, the Father may become reconciled to us. But Christ is not apprehended as a Mediator except by faith. Therefore, by faith alone we obtain remission of sins when we comfort our hearts with confidence in the mercy promised for Christ's sake."
Also, "But when it is said that faith justifies, some perhaps understand it of the beginning,
namely, that faith is the beginning of justification or preparation for justification, so that not faith itself is that through which we are accepted by God,"
Apology of the Augsburg Confession
Part 5
That We Obtain Remission of Sins by Faith Alone in Christ.
http://www.bookofconcord.org/defense_4_justification.php
Thanks church lady,
But I still don't think it'd be proper for me (who left the WELS because of doctrine) to go protest a WELS gathering unless I have some WELS people with me.)
Plus, my daughter caught a bug and we're working through that today. If she's better tomorrow and I get some interest from local WELS folks, we WILL be there with pamphlets.
The plane ride to Wisconsin from Texas isn't that long:)
To say that UOJ states that all men should just go to heaven, is to take out of context what I said. Yes, Romans 5:18 says that justification applies to all men (and it very clearly does) but in context is also clear that no one enters heaven but through Christ. The verdict toward mankind is that through Christ they are not guilt, but a man can certainly deny this mercy, and remain an unbeliever.
I can't remember how this passage has been treated by those involved in this discussion:
"Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sins of the world" (John 1:29).
Fox Mulder, it's not a matter of what you said - it is a matter of what Scripture declares and therefore what the Lutheran Confessions confirm.
The point is that if you claim Romans 5:18 declares all men justified then you have also claimed that all men are saved. Your perversion of the verse demands two realities 1. All men are justified 2. All men are saved because the verse states that Justification bring Life (salvation). You are a Universalist. Scripture and the BOC quotes I posted above condemn your distribution of Christ's righteousness to those who do not have faith and therefore without the Means of Grace.
Mark 4:12, "That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them."
Forgiveness of sins follows faith - UOJ teaches that forgiveness of sins must come before faith otherwise their faith would have nothing to cling to. Therefore their faith is that of the devil and not of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit's faith clings to the Gospel promise of the forgiveness of sins through faith in Christ's perfect life and atoning death.
Ephesians 2:8, "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:"
Anonymous at 12:40pm, John 1:29 declares Christ's payment for the worlds sin, every sin that was ever committed. UOJ states that this is a declaration that Christ took every sin away from the unbelieving world and thus they stand sinless before God. This is clearly false since in John 8:24 Christ declares that if you don't believe in Him you will die in your sins.
John 8:24, "I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins."
This verse is a declaration that Christ paid for the sins of the world. The BOC quotes above show that Christ is our mediator only through faith. Through faith worked by the Holy Spirit Christ brings us to contrition over our sins, dispair of any hope outside of Him and full trust that He paid for my sins and believing, I die to sin and am raised again to life in Christ, forgiven of all sin, justified and righteous in Christ.
UOJ teaches that Christ paid for all sins, that God the Father pronounced by divine verdict that the whole unbelieving world has been justified and stands righteous in His sight, but that if they don't believe it then they'll go to Hell for their sin of unbelief. But wait!! Didn't Christ pay for the sins of unbelief? Unbelief is not the unforgivable sin. We were all born in unbelief.
Romans 11:23, "And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again."
So UOJ has Christ paying for and forgiving all sins, before faith, except the sin of unbelief. Did Christ not pay for that sin? UOJ makes Christ inept. So UOJ has God declaring the whole world forgiven, justified and righteous. Does God not count the sin of unbelief? UOJ makes God a liar because he declares unbelievers forgiven when they really aren't.
To those who confess UOJ Romans 10:3, "For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God."
Consider this verse:
Philippians 3:9, "And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:"
Brett's right, or rather, the Scriptures and BoC are, to which Brett holds firmly, as do I.
Some UOJers, though, I believe ARE sincerely seeking to understand, but maybe I am wrongly hopeful...yet they appear to be giving their true names...God knows, not I.
However, I would ask Michael Scottey, Fox Mulden, I. J. Reilly and any other convinced Ojers to consider reading going through the ACTS OF THE APOSTLES,for it was the Apostles commissioned personally by Christ who FIRST preached, after the death, resurrection, and ascencion of Christ.
And what do we find on the day of Pentecost ? 2:14 ...Peter,standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: (from v.15 onwards - read it ! -he preaches concerning the message of the prophet Joel of what wonders in heaven above, and signs in earth beneath shall come to pass in the LAST DAYS, BEFORE THAT GREAT AND NOTABLE DAY OF THE LORD COME:...that whosever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved...He describes the work and miracles of Jesus of Nazareth among them ...v23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and forknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands HAVE CRUCIFIED and slain: 24 Whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it.............32This Jesus hath God RAISED UP whereof we all are witnesses.
"....God hath made that same Jesus, whom YE HAVE CRUCIFIED, both Lord and Christ (2:36)..:
37 "Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do ?"
In other words, they were afraid, made aware of their guilt - BECAUSE of Peter's truthful preaching OF THE LAW and now desperately wanting to know if anything could be done about it...)
ACTS 2: 38 "Then Peter said unto them, REPENT, AND BE BAPTIZED EVERYONE OF YOU in the name of Jesus Christ FOR THE REMISSION OF SIN, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. 39 For the PROMISE is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call. 40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation. 41 Then THEY THAT GLADLY RECEIVED HIS WORD WERE BAPTIZED.....
UOJers NEVER ever quote from the ACTS, because its teaching can in no way be misconstrued to in any way at all support UOJ. Note how Peter declared the whole counsel of God...He said REPENT first !
The BoC teaches us what REPEENTANCE means, as much stuff on this site does also/& Sermons.. . REPENTANCE Has two parts: 1)SORROW FOR SIN (i.e. contrition),and 2)FAITH IN CHRIST (that is, in His substitutionary death on the cross FOR the sins of the world; i.e. The Atonement, as Brett said.
So what did the Apostle Peter say ?
"REPENT & BE BAPTIZED everyone of you in the name of Jesus Christ FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS, and ye SHALL RECEIVE THE GIFT of the Holy Ghost.
We see, then, how faithful was the Apostle in obeying Christ; whereas UOJers make null and void that very plain, basic, and unable-to- be-misunderstood request of the then risen Lord Jesus Christ in LUKE 24:47 "...that REPENTANCE AND REMISSION OF SINS SHOULD BE PREACHED IN HIS NAME AMONG ALL NATIONS.."
Sinners are left high and dry with what is preached in the synods concerning the right understanding of God's Word. The contents of OJ/UOJ/SJ is unedifying and sickening.
How DARE mere men in the church think they know better than our Lord Jesus Christ what should be taught in HIS church !
Sincerely in Christ,
Orthodox Lutheran
Here is WELSian Siegbert W. Becker's quote from his Justification essay. I've placed Holy Scripture in bold which rejects his false doctrine of Objective Justification.
http://www.wlsessays.net/files/BeckerJustification.PDF
Becker, "But universal and objective justification is one doctrine whose place in the victorious Christian life is clear. Wherever men teach that faith comes first as a condition that must be fulfilled or a work that must be done or even as a fact that must be recognized before forgiven(ess) is bestowed (Note here bestowed = imputed) (Mark 2:5, "When Jesus saw their faith, he said unto the sick of the palsy, Son, thy sins be forgiven thee.") or becomes real, (Mark 4:12, "That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them.") men will be trained to look into their own hearts for assurance rather than to the words and promises of God. If my sins are forgiven only if I first have faith (Acts 10:43, "To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.") then I have no solid foundation on which to rest my hope for eternal life (Romans 8:24, "For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?"). I must then know that I have faith before I can know that my sins are forgiven (John 3:18, "He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.")
But there are times when a Christian does not know that he has faith (Mark 16:16, "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.") (Romans 10:9, "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."). And many people who think they have faith do not have it, and many that think they are not believers are believing children of God (Hebrews 11:6, "But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."). In regard to
our own faith we may be in error or filled with doubt (Romans 14:23, "And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.") But there is nothing uncertain in the truth that is proclaimed in the Gospel. Your sin is taken away, wiped out, forgiven, cancelled, swallowed up in the empty grave in Joseph’s garden. To that we must cling. To that we can cling. On that we can build a solid hope that will not make us ashamed.
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In times of temptation when I am no longer aware of my faith, when my heart tells me that I am an unbeliever, I have no place to turn for assurance if faith must come before forgiveness (Romans 4:16, "Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all"). But if forgiveness comes first, if it is always there, if it is true whether I believe it or not, I do not need to know whether I have faith or not before I can cling to God’s promise (Romans 11:20, "Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith.") (2 Cor. 13:5, "Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?). I know that my sins are forgiven whether I feel forgiven or unforgiven. I know that my iniquity is pardoned whether I believe it or not (Romans 9:31-32, "But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness. Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith"). And when I know that, then I know also that I am a believer (James 2:19, "Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble." Knowledge without faith does not make someone a believer - the devils know Christ paid for the worlds sin but are not believers). John teaches us that when he writes, “Brethren, if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart and knows all things.” Take away objective and universal justification and you have gone a long way toward cutting the heart out of the Gospel message.
Romans 10:4, "For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth."
Luke 7:50, "And he said to the woman, Thy faith hath saved thee; go in peace"
Luke 8:48, "And he said unto her, Daughter, be of good comfort: thy faith hath made thee whole; go in peace."
Romans 4:5, "But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness."
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