dk has left a new comment on your post "DK's Big Van Available for Confessional Raid on Ch...":
IJ Reilly, I'm not sure if you're Confessional or a C&Cer so take this how you want:
It's better to do something about a problem than to sit around and gripe. I'm not saying anything about you or readers of this site, but there are A LOT of Confessional WELSians that just gripe. That's part of the reason the WELS is where it is; because the people who actually saw the problems just complained and stuck their heads in the sand of "it'll never happen to us".
What've you done Reilly? I've informed at least 15 people (five pastors)about UOJ, most of whom have done the applicable homework (easier thanks to Dr. Jackson) and come away with the belief that UOJ actually does challenge the efficacy of the Word. Beyond that, I've been writing to old friends who were led astray (towards Enthusiasm) with me back at WLC. I'm engaging people in conversation about the problems in the WELS and LCMS, asking hard questions of people who've been given authority.
I'm not "oh so proud" of anything I've done in this regard. It's small potatoes. But at least I go beyond complaining. And if I want to go pass out fliers to C&Cers at their little convention (and maybe paint my van) more power to me.
Chronic gripers are marginalized and petty.
Dr. Jackson's Lincoln is truly the Uber-Swank and house paint would sully it. Must be my van.
dk has left a new comment on your post "Responsive Reading for Church and Chicanery Openin...":
If you could write me a one paragraph statement about how Church and Change wants to destroy the Efficacy of the Word I would appreciate it.
I'm going to go down to the C&C conference and pass out fliers. I'd really like to engage some of these folks in conversation and give them a flier with a concise summary on it.
I'd really love to have a group of Confessional WELS folks to join me. I can fit about ten people in my van. Maybe if we don't make a spectacle (will a painted van) people will be more likely to join me.
Email me if you're interested in joining me. My goal is win over our fellow Christians and to fight the Enthusiasm that's infecting the WELS.
email Dave at
GJ - Here is my paragraph. Copy and paste as you see fit:
Church and Change began--and still exists--to promote the false doctrine and unionism of Fuller Seminary and its offspring in WELS. This group hired Baptist Ed Stetzer to teach WELS members and pastors the Word of God - only the intervention of the District Presidents stopped them. Earlier they hired Leonard Sweet! This organization trusts human methods rather than the efficacy of the Word. They are eager to replace Biblical worship with rock entertainment, as if people could be sneaked into the Kingdom of God rather than converted by the Gospel Promises. They believe coaching, a current business fad, will make the church grow. They despise the Means of Grace, as proven by their loathing of the liturgy and Creeds, their refusal to serve Holy Communion at Sunday services, and their blatant copying of the sermons of false teachers: Mark Driscoll, Craig Groeschel, Bill Hybels. The leaders of this group have knelt at the feet of false teachers at Fuller Seminary, Denver, and Gordon Conwell to earn their DMins in Church Growth. They worship with false teachers such as Andy Stanley, Ed Stetzer, and Mark Driscoll.
KJV 2 Timothy 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
KJV Isaiah 55:8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. 9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts. 10 For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater: 11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.
"Wohl scheint auf den ersten Blick die ganze Differenz recht unbedeutend; aber in Wahrheit gibt sich hier die gefaehrliche Richtung der Pietisten zu erkennen, das Leben ueber die Lehre, die Heiligung ueber die Rechtfertigung und die Froemmigkeit nicht als Folge, sondern als Bedingung der Erleuchtung zu setzen also eine Art Synergismus und Pelagianismus einzufuehren. (At first glance, the total difference seems absolutely paltry, but in truth the dangerous direction of Pietism is made apparent: life over doctrine, sanctification over justification, and piety not as a consequence but declared as a stipulation of enlightenment, leading to a kind of synergism and Pelagianism.)" Adolf Hoenecke, Evangelische-Lutherische Dogmatik, 4 vols., ed., Walter and Otto Hoenecke, Milwaukee: Northwestern Publishing House, 1912, III, p. 253.